Where is Josh D'Amaro?

[Eric Smith]

But do they want to experience it for the next 50 years?

It depends on how Star Wars goes, but I think it will be popular for at least the next 25 years.

The Epcot hotel is a no brainer.

 

[MickeyWaffles]

An Epcot hotel would have a huge draw. One big reason that Beach Club and Boardwalk are so popular is that you can walk straight in to Epcot, no need to get on a bus. It's the same thing for the Contemporary and to some extent all of the monorail resorts. Having stayed at the Grand Californian it's very awesome to be able to walk straight from your hotel in to a theme park.

Exactly. DCA may be my least favorite US Disney park and being able to enter from Grand Californian is the absolute best. Having a hotel right in Epcot? People will be all over it. So many people do trips primarily for the Epcot festivals. That hotel will be consistently jam packed.

 

[ford91exploder]

The true test of what D'Amaro can change is approaching. With the vaccine rollout, in the very near future it should be possible for Disney to bring back some experiences safely. I realize they are held more accountable than other theme parks due to their size, but such things as science proving 3 feet apart in masks is as safe as 6 feet apart in masks should allow for some relaxation and reinstating some previous experiences. We will soon see what was money and what was safety motivated.

It was ALL money, except for the shows no way to make them safe. I expect to see little of what was cut make a return to WDW until the current management team is nothing but a bad memory.

 

[ford91exploder]

please state your age bracket and income level. Please, also run the same projections for 20-30 year old people for the next 20 years... get back with me.

Empirical evidence is the worst form of data to use when trying to make an inductive argument. Most towns in America can’t afford current pensions, towns can’t rebuild roads, schools are under funded... only Disney nerds deny the reality that their Magical Kingdom will alway be magically awesome.

Disney's counting on a global market, Not the current US residents who are being impoverished by corporate america (which includes Disney and its numerous Igervilles with CM's sleeping in tents and cars).

This is another reason we sold our DVC we could not in good conscience continue to pay thousands of dollars per year to a company whose business plan includes subsidizing its payroll with public assistance dollars.

 

[yorkieteacher]

Eventually (and it is approaching faster) I will have to decide if the increasing cost is worth the decreasing experience. We went to Universal and Legoland last summer for much less money and enjoyed ourselves tremendously. European tours looks wonderful, partly because they are forbidden fruit right now! I'm one of the Disney fanatics, but we are only going this upcoming June because it is a convention, and the company picks up gas and hotel costs. If Josh D'Amaro and company decide their target audience is families who plan a once or twice a lifetime trip, the company won't need to spend much money adding new experiences or bringing back beloved ones. I'd be interested to learn what the theme park spending demographics are- passholders, guests who return once or twice a year, or people who only visit only every 5-10 years or less.

 

[Drew729]

Eventually (and it is approaching faster) I will have to decide if the increasing cost is worth the decreasing experience. We went to Universal and Legoland last summer for much less money and enjoyed ourselves tremendously. European tours looks wonderful, partly because they are forbidden fruit right now! I'm one of the Disney fanatics, but we are only going this upcoming June because it is a convention, and the company picks up gas and hotel costs. If Josh D'Amaro and company decide their target audience is families who plan a once or twice a lifetime trip, the company won't need to spend much money adding new experiences or bringing back beloved ones. I'd be interested to learn what the theme park spending demographics are- passholders, guests who return once or twice a year, or people who only visit only every 5-10 years or less.

We actually just purchased the Universal annual pass (actually 15 months). The value for Disney parks is just not there currently for us, not that Universal is better than Disney but it is a better value IMO at this time.

As a DVC member I have not been able to get in touch with member services by phone, three times I tried gave up after an hour of being on hold. We love our home resort and will stay there while on vacation but my wife agreed that Disney’s parks are on hold for at least two years and meals will be offsite since we will be renting a car (thanks to no DME). This is not an emotional decision just one that that works for us currently.

Disney as a corporation can make whatever decisions they feel are necessary for their best interest and as a consumer I will do the same.

 

[jade1]

The cashing in was a sad day, But we had enough of the poor service starting in 2015 a vacation is not having the rest of the family go out and enjoy themselves while you camp out at the front desk trying to get something fixed which should have been fixed before you arrived.

Yep and selling for whatever reason, worked out well.

 

[ford91exploder]

Yep and selling for whatever reason, worked out well.

Yes I sold when DVC had a great reputation, What happens if member services continues to be unreachable maintenance continues its slide to ‘minimum necessary to keep room in service’ instead of the past ‘maintain to as new standard’ There is no excuse for Member Services to be unreachable. It should be staffed to answer in three rings, DVC while only able to use 25% of its inventory is still getting members full member fees and mortgage payments and there should be a huge breakage inventory to cede to CRO.

it's financially driven stuff like this which destroys a brand over time.

what happens to the dvc people then, they will take a huge loss on their DVC properties because the thing which maintains the prices has been the amazing park experience and the amazing quality of the resorts when both becomes ordinary there will be nothing to maintain the one time value in DVC

 

[Eric Smith]

Yes I sold when DVC had a great reputation, What happens if member services continues to be unreachable maintenance continues its slide to ‘minimum necessary to keep room in service’ instead of the past ‘maintain to as new standard’ There is no excuse for Member Services to be unreachable. It should be staffed to answer in three rings, DVC while only able to use 25% of its inventory is still getting members full member fees and mortgage payments and there should be a huge breakage inventory to cede to CRO.

it's financially driven stuff like this which destroys a brand over time.

what happens to the dvc people then, they will take a huge loss on their DVC properties because the thing which maintains the prices has been the amazing park experience and the amazing quality of the resorts when both becomes ordinary there will be nothing to maintain the one time value in DVC

The quality of the resorts is very good and the park experience is still great. This is like an old man sitting on a park bench and taking about the “good old days.”

 

[ChipnDale79]

The quality of the resorts is very good and the park experience is still great. This is like an old man sitting on a park bench and taking about the “good old days.”

A lot of us are in different places in our views of Disney because of the product we've paid for in the past. I've seen your post reminding people that disney is a business as well. It's clear you have a different view on things as others.

When businesses go to far with their pricing, they're going to have "old" people sitting on the bench complaining about how it used to be, the question is, how many people can they afford to do that too? They have to weigh that variable when they make business decisions as well.

What Disney has done over the past few years with the massive price increases and cutting of hours and experiences has left a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths and they are making decisions to do other things.

My wife and i have been the go to disney people in our circle of friends and family when they want to plan a trip for years. We've noticed a pattern over the last 3-4 years when people come back. It used to be, "we cant wait to plan our next trip", to now we hear more of "it was fun, but it was really expensive, im glad we did it once, if we go back it'll be a long time".

No one disagrees that Disney is a business and they are supposed to be making a profit, but Disney Themeparks are a tourist destination, that's it, nothing more, nothing less, and people can and are cutting back their vacations to disney.

We've been every year since we got married in 2008, and there are a few years we went more than once (sometimes 5 times in a year and we live 8 hours away). We didnt go in 2020, and it had nothing to do with Covid, we were booked for a non disney cruise (didnt get to do that), and have now moved to an every other year rotation for Disney.

It's too much for us to justify, and if @ford91exploder is an old man sitting on a bench complaining about how things used to be, then i'm just another person sitting with them on a very large bench.

I was pricing out our trip the other day, including picking counter and table service restaurant locations, trying to get a feel for how much i need to account for spending money. Apparently i did the same thing in 2017, for 8 days of food, it was about $500 more expensive than it was 4 years ago for a family of 4. That's a huge increase, and that's just one part that has increased in that time frame. It's a lot.

 

[Eric Smith]

A lot of us are in different places in our views of Disney because of the product we've paid for in the past. I've seen your post reminding people that disney is a business as well. It's clear you have a different view on things as others.

When businesses go to far with their pricing, they're going to have "old" people sitting on the bench complaining about how it used to be, the question is, how many people can they afford to do that too? They have to weigh that variable when they make business decisions as well.

What Disney has done over the past few years with the massive price increases and cutting of hours and experiences has left a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths and they are making decisions to do other things.

My wife and i have been the go to disney people in our circle of friends and family when they want to plan a trip for years. We've noticed a pattern over the last 3-4 years when people come back. It used to be, "we cant wait to plan our next trip", to now we hear more of "it was fun, but it was really expensive, im glad we did it once, if we go back it'll be a long time".

No one disagrees that Disney is a business and they are supposed to be making a profit, but Disney Themeparks are a tourist destination, that's it, nothing more, nothing less, and people can and are cutting back their vacations to disney.

We've been every year since we got married in 2008, and there are a few years we went more than once (sometimes 5 times in a year and we live 8 hours away). We didnt go in 2020, and it had nothing to do with Covid, we were booked for a non disney cruise (didnt get to do that), and have now moved to an every other year rotation for Disney.

It's too much for us to justify, and if @ford91exploder is an old man sitting on a bench complaining about how things used to be, then i'm just another person sitting with them on a very large bench.

I was pricing out our trip the other day, including picking counter and table service restaurant locations, trying to get a feel for how much i need to account for spending money. Apparently i did the same thing in 2017, for 8 days of food, it was about $500 more expensive than it was 4 years ago for a family of 4. That's a huge increase, and that's just one part that has increased in that time frame. It's a lot.

The “problem” with Disney is that going to the parks is more possible than ever. Disney World got in to a problem where the parks were too crowded. They raised prices to try to cut the raw attendance numbers down a bit. It needed to happen. I understand that we always think that the way things were back in the “good old days” were the best, but that’s often because we’re wearing rose colored glasses.

 

[Jrb1979]

The “problem” with Disney is that going to the parks is more possible than ever. Disney World got in to a problem where the parks were too crowded. They raised prices to try to cut the raw attendance numbers down a bit. It needed to happen. I understand that we always think that the way things were back in the “good old days” were the best, but that’s often because we’re wearing rose colored glasses.

I disagree that is cause of rose colored glasses. You used to be able to visit the parks late into the evening almost year round. Then they decided why not charge for that. Let's not even start with what they call good food at Character meals.

 

[ford91exploder]

I disagree that is cause of rose colored glasses. You used to be able to visit the parks late into the evening almost year round. Then they decided why not charge for that. Let's not even start with what they call good food at Character meals.

Some might recall a gentleman by the name of Kevin Yee who wrote a couple of articles called Declining By Degrees He was a hard core Disney Fan who worked his way up into lower management. But Disney left him, I'm not sure he eevisits the parks any longer. But he joined the cast back when 'Traditions' i.e. CM basic training lasted 2 entire weeks, Now Disney did it succesfully for decades and created a huge cadre of people steeped in the Disney tradition.

And no it was not about giving out free stuff or FP's like today. It was about finding out what the guest REALLY needed or wanted. Both my DMIL and myself attended the 'Disney Institute' she as a senior healthcare executive, Myself as a professional services manager (you buy a few million of IT equipment/services from us and if you have a problem a member of my team or myself goes out to make it right) so I'm in the customer service business myself

The decline became a runaway train back in 2015 or so, Even in march and november before then. the MK was open till 11pm or later on a regular basis, Many times there were TWO fireworks shows one at 9 and another at 11 and the park was open for an hour or so after that. The parties were SPECIAL and inexpensive and there were perhaps 4-6 during the entire holiday season.

even runDisney was affected disney cranked up the entry fees and on one memorable DL 5k they cut the characters entirely DW was there at that race and the running boards lit up over that one, as runDisney is about FUN people often mock some of the overweight people in the race but it were not for Disney and the FUN element those people not have made that first step to better health. But Disney thought removing the FUN would grab them a few more bucks.

In summation its not rose colored glasses, Disney has hollowed out and ratcheted up the price of their product and fewer and fewer are seeing the VALUE in the product any longer.

Like the PP we were the ones who helped others setup their Disney vacations prior to 2015 after they got back it was always when can I go again, Now it's well it was fun but probably not going back.

I probably would have kept our DVC even in the face of fast increasing MF's IF the VALUE was there still, dont try and sell me a 24 ounce package of ice cream and tell me it's a quart. But as maintenance and perks were cut back and MF's went up rapidly the value was no longer there.

Our tradition was to spend the last day at the MK late and ride Small World just before closing corny but we loved it. I miss WDW but I cannot validate the current greed driven business model by visiting.

 

[adam.adbe]

A lot of us are in different places in our views of Disney because of the product we've paid for in the past. I've seen your post reminding people that disney is a business as well. It's clear you have a different view on things as others.

OLC is a business too, but the overall quality and value for money of the Japanese parks is just better than WDW. I get the broad argument that Eric is trying to make here; WDW was bursting at the seams and something had to give, but frankly for me since 2013 it seems like every year's increase in park/resort attendance has been matched by a corresponding reduction in included entertainment, so the crowd problem is being artificially worsened. More people with less to do, or less reason to be anywhere but the parks or Disney Springs, equals more apparent crowds.

I'm not even grumbling about the price hikes, although I've said before, I can often option out a 7-10 night Japan trip including JR Rail Pass, a couple of days at Tokyo Disney, and other attractions (Ghibli Museum, for ex) for less than 6 nights at WDW. I'm grumbling about quality. OK Disney want to price WDW so it's a once every three to five years thing for most families, not a once every one to two years, I get that. That math needs the experience to be field leading though, and WDW just isn't anymore.

 

[ChipnDale79]

The “problem” with Disney is that going to the parks is more possible than ever. Disney World got in to a problem where the parks were too crowded. They raised prices to try to cut the raw attendance numbers down a bit. It needed to happen. I understand that we always think that the way things were back in the “good old days” were the best, but that’s often because we’re wearing rose colored glasses.

dont buy the argument that they raised prices to cut crowds. They want the parks filled at capacity every day for the highest ticket price possible.

They've over built the hotels, they need a 5th gate, or actually expand the parks by adding more space to them.

they're trying to solve the crowd issue, the lazy way, and way that might hurt them long term.

 

[ford91exploder]

OLC is a business too, but the overall quality and value for money of the Japanese parks is just better than WDW. I get the broad argument that Eric is trying to make here; WDW was bursting at the seams and something had to give, but frankly for me since 2013 it seems like every year's increase in park/resort attendance has been matched by a corresponding reduction in included entertainment, so the crowd problem is being artificially worsened. More people with less to do, or less reason to be anywhere but the parks or Disney Springs, equals more apparent crowds.

I'm not even grumbling about the price hikes, although I've said before, I can often option out a 7-10 night Japan trip including JR Rail Pass, a couple of days at Tokyo Disney, and other attractions (Ghibli Museum, for ex) for less than 6 nights at WDW. I'm grumbling about quality. OK Disney want to price WDW so it's a once every three to five years thing for most families, not a once every one to two years, I get that. That math needs the experience to be field leading though, and WDW just isn't anymore.

Its pathetic that one needs to go to Japan and visit a park not even owned by Disney to get a Disney experience the way Walt envisioned a Disney experience rather than the way Wall st envisions the experience

whats even worse is its frequently cheaper to fly halfway around the world and stay in one of the most expensive cities in the world (Tokyo) than it is to hop on southwest and fly to Orlando

 

[Eric Smith]

Its pathetic that one needs to go to Japan and visit a park not even owned by Disney to get a Disney experience the way Walt envisioned a Disney experience rather than the way Wall st envisions the experience

whats even worse is its frequently cheaper to fly halfway around the world and stay in one of the most expensive cities in the world (Tokyo) than it is to hop on southwest and fly to Orlando

We don't know what Walt wants.

Also, Tokyo isn't that expensive for a large city.

 

[Douglas Dubh]

I’ve been to Tokyo Disney twice, in 2014 and 2016, for four days each trip. While there’s definitely so great stuff there, it‘s not that much greater or a better value than WDW.

 

[mamaofsix]

it seems like every year's increase in park/resort attendance has been matched by a corresponding reduction in included entertainment, so the crowd problem is being artificially worsened. More people with less to do, or less reason to be anywhere but the parks or Disney Springs, equals more apparent crowds.

Exactly this. Hopefully things get better and more attractions / entertainment start being added back in again, but I'm not so sure...

 

[Peter Venkman]

It’s always been about the bottom line. Disney is a business, not a charity.

it is always about the bottom line, but it used to be that after vacuuming every cent out of your pocket that they could, they still wanted you to walk out thinking, "that was worth every penny." IMO Iger and Chapek aren't so concerned about that last part, its seems more "give them less while taking them for everything we can because these suckers will keep coming no matter what.".....and they're not entirely wrong in that thinking.