Whiney letter that I'm sending to WDW about access...

BillSears

DIS Veteran
Joined
Mar 1, 2003
I probably have been overeacting to this problem but I really hate watching people walk right past me and enter/board an attraction while I have to wait because I use a wheelchair. So I'm going to send this letter to WDW tomorrow about the situation. Feel free to comment even if it's just to tell me I'm expecting too much. :)

Dear Walt Disney World/Guest Communications/Executive Offices,

Recently I have run into a problem with the way wheelchair access to certain attractions is handled. I am a paraplegic who has visited Walt Disney World 12 times over the past 30 years and I’ve seen many different ways that access has been provided. On my first trip in 1977 it was fairly hard to get around but things became much easier as time went on. In my opinion the access provided actually became too easy with Disney offering almost all access through the exits of the attractions and people began abusing the system by renting a wheelchair just for the access it provided. I believe in part Disney began mainstreaming their line access to prevent these types of abuses and I agree wholeheartedly with this. I am not looking for superior access to attractions however I would like equal access to attractions.

The problem I’ve had in the past year or so is the waiting in two lines if you’re a wheelchair user or waiting in a line while non wheelchair users have immediate access. On some attractions there is a small capacity for wheelchair users so the “wheelchair section” often will fill up and I would have to wait for a second show while non wheelchair users would walk right in past me. Some attractions have wheelchair users wait in the normal line and then right at the boarding area divert the wheelchair user to a separate boarding area where they wait in a second line to board.

I feel that most people with handicaps just want to be treated like everyone else. Walt Disney World is the place I go to where I know I don’t have to worry about whether there will be a curbcut, or stairs, or a hotel room with poor wheelchair accommodations, or a bus without a lift, or many of the other day to day concerns I have. At Walt Disney World I’m just a normal guest and I love it. However being told that because you’re a wheelchair user you can’t attend this showing of something and then sitting off to the side watching people walk right in is very disheartening. It takes a wonderful day and brings it to a screeching halt for me. It’s a cold hard slap in the face saying that no I’m not like others I’m still a second class person even here at Walt Disney World.

In my opinion the worst place for this is the Enchanted Tiki Room. It’s gotten so bad at this attraction that they’ve had a sign made saying that the wheelchair section is full and that wheelchair users will have to wait for the next show. I may be being too sensitive about this but I personally find the sign to be offensive. It’s not the language itself of the sign but instead it’s the fact that Disney knows that there is a problem with wheelchair capacity at this ride and their solution is to just make a sign instead of actually fixing the problem. They allow 4 wheelchair users at this attraction at a time and they send these 4 in before the rest of the audience to sit on the exit side of the theater. A simple way to double capacity here would be to send 4 in for the exit side and then have 4 more wheelchair users enter in at the end of the crowd to sit at the entrance side.

I’ve also run into the problem of having to wait for the next show while others are allowed to walk in at the American Adventure, Journey into Narnia and the Little Mermaid. At the American Adventure I was told that there were spaces available but because general seating had already started they couldn’t take me upstairs in the elevator. At the Little Mermaid and Journey into Narnia they had reached the capacity for wheelchair users. I can also see this might be a problem at Lights Motor Action since the wheelchair seating there seems limited however I’ve always shown up early for this show and haven’t been denied access.

Some of the rides where wheelchair users wait in the normal line and then a second line to board the ride are the Finding Nemo ride, Buzz Lightyear’s Space Ranger Spin, Rock n Roller Coaster, and probably the worst one of all the Kilimanjaro Safari. I’ve had the Kilimanjaro Safari be a walk on ride for those people who walk while I waited 20 minutes for my turn to use the wheelchair accessible ride vehicle. Sometimes these second waits are only until the accessible ride vehicle (or the car set aside specifically for those with mobility problems like at the Haunted Mansion or Spaceship Earth) cycles around to the exit however other times I’ve had as many as 4 people waiting in line in front of me for the ride vehicle and that can add a long wait to the normal wait that you’ve already had by going through the normal queue.

The ideal Disney should be shooting for is equal access for wheelchair users not superior and not inferior access. To be denied access because a show does not have sufficient seating for wheelchair using guests is not equal access. To wait through a normal queue and then be sent off to a second queue to wait for another 10-20 minutes or longer is not equal access. I’ve always traveled to Walt Disney World at slow times of the year but I’ve had all of the above happen to me in mid September 2006, the first week of December 2006, the middle of May 2007 and the beginning of September 2007. Considering that these are slower times of the year I can’t imagine how bad the situation must be during the busy times at Walt Disney World.

I do want to let you know that I am extremely pleased with certain attractions at Walt Disney World. Two attractions that stand out are Expedition Everest and Soarin. Both of these rides have totally mainstreamed queues and once you’re at the front of the line you board immediately. Having an easy access car on every train at Expedition Everest is one of the best accommodations I’ve ever seen on a roller coaster. I get to experience the fantastic queues at Expedition Everest and then I get to board right away just like everyone else. I wish all rides could be as accessible.

As our population ages I can see more and more wheelchair and ECV users visiting Walt Disney World in the future. Because of this now is the time to start making changes to accommodate the increased demand for access. Walt Disney World is my favorite vacation spot and the access that you provide for wheelchair users is one of the more important reasons I visit there. Please continue to provide equal access for those of us who use wheelchairs.

Sincerely,
William(Bill) Sears
 
A very good letter, and you make some very valid points. I just don't see Disney doing anything immediately though - as attractions get redone, or new ones built (like EE) I hope they will continue to mainstream and make accessible ride vehicles.

One thing you could do is research the ADA, and see if the ratio of accessible seating/vehicles is within their guidlelines, if they have any. If they don't have any guidelines for that, then I think you are at the mercy of Disney.
 
Wonderful letter. I certainly couldn't have said it better. I really hope they take it to heart.

Suzanne
 
This was a very well written letter. The only thing that came to mind in reference to the show capacities (like Tiki room) is there might be a mandate from the fire marshall on how the room would/could be evacuated and that *might* be why there is limited wheelchair seating areas. The Tiki room is fairly old, and it might need a major remodel to accomodate more wheel chair seating that would also have safe evacuation margins. As ADA has become more mainstream, more attractions are wheelchair friendly and it was kind of you to note that in your letter as well. However, I am baffled as to why the Kilamanjaro Safari would be such a long wheelchair wait. You would think they would have those vehicles at least in a standby area..but since I'm not a CM I don't know their proceedure or protocols.

It was a nice, well written letter.
 
From what we saw on KS, it will only hold 1 or maybe 2 wheelchairs at a time. Now my mom and I use ECV's and we can walk onto the ride, but we had to wait in the special area and you can wait there forever. We saw many trucks leave and even return before we had moved up the line. I also think more shows should be like Beauty and the Beast, they have a HC section up front for tose who can transfer and for those that can't and they have a section in the back of the theater as well.

Suzanne
 
I'm not really bothered by the show capacities since they all (including my movie theatres at home) suffer from the same limitations in space.

Only ones I get a bit peeved about are the rides with limited numbers of wheelchair-capable vehicles. These require you to wait double the normally posted time because first you must make your way through the main queu then to a special wheelchair queue.

Before the abuse started, wheelchair users were just directed toward the FastPass or wheelchair queue and waited the same time as anyone else. Now you need to get a FastPass, red card or wait double.

Rides like Buzz Lightyear, Winnie the Pooh and It's A Small World are the big pains. IASW redid it's entry queue in a way I find the most bizarre and routinely misused. (Pre-remodel all wheelchair guests would enter via the exit and go wait in line by the dock for the wheelchair boats to come through. Now you must go through the queue halfway, then enter the exit and go down to wait for the wheelchair boat. Some CMs just direct you to the exit right away and some guests remember the old way and use the exit. And there are times when the CMs get completely anal about waiting in the main queue for an extra 15 minutes before waiting another 15 or so below.)

I think it makes more sense to separate out those who can transfer from those who need the wheelchair vehicles. Then you have a waiting time based solely on the wheelchair guest load. If 5 wheelchair users are in line then it will take 5 boats, or 5 trips around to clear the queue.

Kilamanjaro Safari is the most deceptive and in need of help. The busses never run as regularly as the main queue and yet can have a backup of dozens of ECV and wheelchair users. All ECVs are sent into the main queue then sorted in the wheelchair bus bay. So you can easily walk right onto KS with a 5 minute wait outside, then wait for 3 or 4 wheelchair busses to load and empty. Meanwhile, everyone who walked onto the queue after you has completed their journey. And to make matters worse the wheelchair user has no idea what the wheelchair queue is like prior to getting to it.
 
Thanks for the comments guys. I always feel like I should not complain and be happy with whatever access I can get. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who sometimes feels Disney could do better.

One thing you could do is research the ADA, and see if the ratio of accessible seating/vehicles is within their guidlelines, if they have any. If they don't have any guidelines for that, then I think you are at the mercy of Disney.

I'm not really bothered by the show capacities since they all (including my movie theatres at home) suffer from the same limitations in space.

The problem with comparing ADA laws and capacities outside of WDW is that once you go to WDW it's totally different then the regular world. WDW involves much more walking then most people do at home therefore people who would never dream of using a wheelchair/ECV to go to the movies use a wheelchair/ECV at WDW. I'm not saying that people shouldn't be doing this, if you need a wheelchair/ECV please get one. However Disney needs to understand that wheelchair/ECV use will be much higher at WDW then it is for normal places. I rarely run into another wheelchair/ECV user at my local movie theaters but at WDW all you have to do is turn around and you're bound to see a wheelchair/ECV user in sight. Disney should be planning wheelchair/ECV capacity based on the percentage of people who use wheelchairs/ECVs at WDW and add a cushion for extra measure.
 


I think it was a very well written letter. Don't be surprised if you get a phone call from someone at the Executive Offices.

If you do talk to someone, I think almost every time I've gone to It's Tough To Be a Bug I have had to waid for a subsequent show while people were still filng into the theater five minutes after I was stopped.
 
I'm taking this as a big warning that we better plan on a lot of waiting even though we chose a quiet time of year.:sad1: Do you suggest we should try to carry Alize on these rides (34 pounds and stiff as a board). Karen
 
Thank you for writing the letter, which, by the way, I found in no way whiney (believe me, I have a 5 yr old and a 4yr old, AND I taught Kindergarten for 5 years before becoming a SAHM--I KNOW WHINEY!) and very informative to an organization that seems to legitimately care about serving people with disabilities. We had "good" access experiences even in busy July--but Nemo and Buzz Lightyear do stand out as attractions that we had to wait much longer than others without a wheelchair.
To Alizesmom . . . in no way, even during busy July, would I have considered carrying my child (45 lbs) through the normal line. (Except the teacups--I did carry him through there because no one seemed to know what I should do with the wheelchair and the line was narrow but short?) Anyway, all attractions gave us access with a wheelchair (that's better than any other amusement park we've visited), and most had equitable wait times. I will praise and thank Disney all day long for being "good" about access, but BillSears is right--Disney should continue to work on those attractions that are unequal. There's nothing wrong with pointing that out. Thanks from all of us!!!
 
I agree 100% about Kilamanjaro Safari. It's a pain having to wait for the next handicap truck while the rest of the guests keep filing past. That always upsets me. My mom is in a wheelchair at WDW for hidden illnesses that you can't tell on the outside, however she can transfer, just not walk long distances.

The other attraction that really bothered me this past trip was HISTA. We were told that my family had to seperate because there wasn't enough seating for all of us due to limited seating (we're a party of four, including my mom in the chair). My twin and I ended up sitting a few rows in front of my parents and couldn't enjoy the attraction with them and I thought that was wrong. We waited in line just like everybody else and deserved to watch the show with my mom.

Anyway, nicely written letter. Please let us know if you get a response! :)
 
This was a very well written letter. The only thing that came to mind in reference to the show capacities (like Tiki room) is there might be a mandate from the fire marshall on how the room would/could be evacuated and that *might* be why there is limited wheelchair seating areas. The Tiki room is fairly old, and it might need a major remodel to accomodate more wheel chair seating that would also have safe evacuation margins. As ADA has become more mainstream, more attractions are wheelchair friendly and it was kind of you to note that in your letter as well. However, I am baffled as to why the Kilamanjaro Safari would be such a long wheelchair wait. You would think they would have those vehicles at least in a standby area..but since I'm not a CM I don't know their proceedure or protocols.

It was a nice, well written letter.

That is perfect. I also had this problem. Especially the Kilamanjaro Safari. I had to wait to baord while everyone else took off in their vehicles, I had to wait in the vehicle while other vehicles Zoomed by as we could not pull out, it was frustrating.

Maybe you can start a cyber petition!
Dianne
 
I agree this is a very well written letter. I am planning on parking my wheelchair and walking through the queues for small world and philharmagic for just that reason. I can transfer to a regualr seat and i plan on doing just that...

i was told that disney encourages/makes people with chairs wait for the wheelchair accessible boat on IASW. i can and will transfer, and save the place for someone else. why would i take up the spot if i dont need to?? disney also needs to have more education for their CMs about disability and the best ways to handle it, i think...
 
Good for you in writing and sending this letter. We we return home I always say I'm going to send a letter like this but never do. I also think that for people that are going to use the wheelchair car on rides like pooh and buzz that we should enter through the exit and wait for that car. It never fails that we get there and 3 people before us the car goes by so we have to sand off to the side and wait.

The last time we were at WDW we waited 1 1/2 hours after we reached the part of the line where it splits for KS. There were several people waiting and only 1 vehicle doing wheelchairs. However, I saw several of them leave with a spot for wheelchair tie downs that were being used in the regular line.
 
I agree this is a very well written letter. I am planning on parking my wheelchair and walking through the queues for small world and philharmagic for just that reason. I can transfer to a regualr seat and i plan on doing just that...

i was told that disney encourages/makes people with chairs wait for the wheelchair accessible boat on IASW. i can and will transfer, and save the place for someone else. why would i take up the spot if i dont need to?? disney also needs to have more education for their CMs about disability and the best ways to handle it, i think...

Cms will usually ask if you can transfer etc. When a CM sees a WC or ECV they have to react as though the person needs accomodation. As I said they ask if you can transfer or if you can climb steps etc. if it is applicable. But they cannot start asking detailed questions about what a person's disability is or what there capabilities are beyond the simple relevant questions.

So it falls to the individual to say if a CM directs them to a certain place as they approach a ride or show, " I am parking my chair/ECV and will enter the regular line" etc.
 
Wonderful letter, Bill! And your description of the different rides is very accurate. Thanks for taking the time to write and send it.
 
:thumbsup2 Kudos to you Bill! Great well written letter, detailing what works for you & what doesn't.

As I've mentioned before, we wrote a very lengthy letter to DVC & WDW concerning the lack of access for my DH at SAB at the BC. After many months of no acknowledgement from them, my DH called about it. He was told the letter would not go through because he linked ADA info in it. He was instructed to fax the letter. He received a call back from someone with WDW thanking him for the very well written letter with great background info. to support his request. She said she thought the letter was great, in that he also had concrete suggestions for solutions that were in use elsewhere & ADA recommended. She said she would personally follow through to make sure his letter got to the right people who could address the matter.

I wish more people would take the time to write a letter when an access issue affects their enjoyment of an attraction. A letter like your's Bill, that outlines the specific problems in a clear precise manner & doesn't sound whiney at all!!!! :thumbsup2
 
Bill - you will get a phone call from Guest Communication about two weeks after they receive your letter/email. They do respond to everything, it just usually takes the two weeks.

You've got great points! I do have to say though that my brother, also a parapalegic moved to Orlando to work for the Mouse because it's the most accessible place he's ever been.

But there's always room for improvement. Great letter Bill!
 
Thanks for the encouragement guys! The letter is in the mail and on it's way to WDW.

You've got great points! I do have to say though that my brother, also a parapalegic moved to Orlando to work for the Mouse because it's the most accessible place he's ever been.

Hook's Girl, this is the perfect example of why I called it a whiney letter. I totally agree with your brother! That's what keeps me coming back to WDW. They truly go out of their way to make it better for wheelchair users and it is the most accessible place I've ever been. So to me complaining about certain things at WDW when it's already the most accessible place I've ever vacationed at seems whiney. Some of me feels I should just enjoy what works and just get over what doesn't work. Like others here I've thought about sending this letter for a while and after 4 trips in the past year I've finally decided Disney needs to be told/reminded about these problems.
 
Thanks for the encouragement guys! The letter is in the mail and on it's way to WDW.



Hook's Girl, this is the perfect example of why I called it a whiney letter. I totally agree with your brother! That's what keeps me coming back to WDW. They truly go out of their way to make it better for wheelchair users and it is the most accessible place I've ever been. So to me complaining about certain things at WDW when it's already the most accessible place I've ever vacationed at seems whiney. Some of me feels I should just enjoy what works and just get over what doesn't work. Like others here I've thought about sending this letter for a while and after 4 trips in the past year I've finally decided Disney needs to be told/reminded about these problems.


Well I'm glad you are sending it in, we do need to be reminded about both the good and the bad aspects of our theme parks. There's nothing wrong with a little whining, we all do it. You at least have a justified reason :) I'm really happy you included things like Expedition Everest and Soarin' in the letter. Can't wait to hear the response. And hopefully we will see you down here at the World soon!
 

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