Why are crowds lower this summer?

[anniemae]

It would be kind of shocking if this doesn't happen.

One would think, but you never know. Prices will most likely increase again by then and many could be priced out. Or, people could be so against Avatar Land that they will not go. Many people are very disappointed about Avatar and feel it is a very poor move by Disney. They movies are kind of a mess and taking forever to film. Time will tell. I think it will increase crowds, but it is not a given.

 

[Zippa D Doodah]

I think the reasons are mostly economic. As others have cited, many international currencies are weakening. Playing a smaller role in decreased attendance is the fact that many knowledgeable guests are annoyed with Disney's trimming of hours and entertainment options, all while raising prices. When a company known for its hospitality is being chintzy it just shows, whether we are talking about crappy burger buns or reduced theme park hours. The fact that they have a current money pit in Shanghai maybe the cause of some of this, but TDC is making a mistake if they think people don't notice.

 

[anniemae]

I think the reasons are mostly economic. As others have cited, many international currencies are weakening. Playing a smaller role in decreased attendance is the fact that many knowledgeable guests are annoyed with Disney's trimming of hours and entertainment options, all while raising prices. When a company known for its hospitality is being chintzy it just shows, whether we are talking about crappy burger buns or reduced theme park hours. The fact that they have a current money pit in Shanghai maybe the cause of some of this, but TDC is making a mistake if they think people don't notice.

I agree, especially with the bolded. I don't think it will have a noticeable impact, but it is there.

 

[ettinkerbell]

For my family, its not about "money," but about "value."

We have one last adults only trip planned for Food and Wine festival in November and then we are done. We discussed it as a family on our April spring break trip and the kids are on-board with the decision. We have planned 2 non-Disney vacations for 2017. For us, its not just the increase in prices. Its the price increases coupled with declining value. You pay more and get less. Also, customer service has gone way downhill in our opinion. For us customer service also includes park cleanliness and resort room cleanliness.

Next, it irks me to no end how non-confrontational Disney CMs are with guests who break the rules. I am tired of seeing people scamming the system and getting away with it. (One example - We were behind a family who talked their way into the Fast Pass line and then congratulated each other on how they worked the scam as soon as they were out of the site of the CM). And last, I believe that Disney executives have made a decision to charge more and more for their product trying to maximize profits while reducing costs. This shows up in everything from reduced park hours to generic napkins. I just don't like it so the only way I have to protest is not to go.

I think we need a 2-3 year break and then we will re-evaluate whether or not we want to return to Disney again.

Edited to add: Normally, we would have taken another Disney vacation this summer to maximize the use of our APs. But we are spending a week at another vacation destination instead. We are also not renewing our APs. So we are a very tiny reason the parks are less crowded.

We feel the same - last trip for the next 3 years was this past April. Riverboat cruises here we come. After going 2 to 3 times a year since opening, we hate what has become of Disney service and attitude.

 

[redsbe]

A few years ago, I could compare a 2 week stay at WDW (taking advantage of free dining) with a 2 week stay in the Lake George area, and the cost was pretty similar when we included the cost of all the entertainment and dining we would pay for separately when staying in Lake George. With the recent spate of price increases, and the changes to the free dining promotion making it no longer available to us (it starts too late in the summer for us now), that is no longer the case. I can vacation in Lake George for significantly less than I pay to vacation in Disney World, even counting in the cost of season passes for the Six Flags park there, and what we will pay for mini golf, and boat cruises, gas, shopping, food, hotel etc.



I'm sorry, but there is absolutely NO comparison there! Counter service at Disney World averages nearly $20 per person if you have entree, side (french fries) and a soft drink. I can go to nearly any fast food joint around here (subway, McDonalds, Wendys, Five Guys, KFC etc.) and eat for around $10 to $12 per person.

Table service around here averages around $20 per person, and at Disney World the numbers are more like $30 plus per person, more if you are going to have desert. There is just NO comparison between Disney World prices, and what you pay outside of Disney.

[/QUOTE]

My mistake as did not intend to compare WDW counter or sit down prices with other non-WDW locations as clearly WDW is more expensive, just wanted to point out that any vacation when you are paying for meals there is a higher cost then eating at home or in your room with food you buy to prepare meals.

But some of the WDW table service venues provide food and service at a quality matched by higher end places in my area that are also $30 per person such as top of the line steak, Italian or French restaurants.

 

[redsbe]

I'm only guessing, but I think it's a combination of price and attraction construction timing.

We're on the verge of several major attractions opening in the next few years. I assume there are a lot of Disney visitors that don't go every year, so why would they "waste" a trip this year when they can at least get Avatar (maybe) in the second half of next year?

And yet in early June we found crowds were 8+ as predicted by various crowd calendars - so price and construction were not an impact then when without FP or long waits by mid day you were looking at 60 min+ for the most popular attractions in the WDW parks.

 

[bags4]

I am sure cost has a lot to do with things, it definitely is getting more expensive. We have been to Disney 6 times and this summer will be the 7th and probably the last. What is getting to me is that every minute of my trip has to be planned. Why should I have to know 6 months in advance where I want to eat and what park I might feel like that day and now also know what time to be at certain rides. Way to much planning for a "vacation" that should be relaxing. This is what is doing it for me. I feel for people who have never been, pay all that money, don't really know how it works or how much of a Disney expert you have to be to strategize to get what you want and then when they get there will be disappointed. Anyhow that is what is taking the magic away for me.

 

[quandrea]

For my family, its not about "money," but about "value."

We have one last adults only trip planned for Food and Wine festival in November and then we are done. We discussed it as a family on our April spring break trip and the kids are on-board with the decision. We have planned 2 non-Disney vacations for 2017. For us, its not just the increase in prices. Its the price increases coupled with declining value. You pay more and get less. Also, customer service has gone way downhill in our opinion. For us customer service also includes park cleanliness and resort room cleanliness.

Next, it irks me to no end how non-confrontational Disney CMs are with guests who break the rules. I am tired of seeing people scamming the system and getting away with it. (One example - We were behind a family who talked their way into the Fast Pass line and then congratulated each other on how they worked the scam as soon as they were out of the site of the CM). And last, I believe that Disney executives have made a decision to charge more and more for their product trying to maximize profits while reducing costs. This shows up in everything from reduced park hours to generic napkins. I just don't like it so the only way I have to protest is not to go.

I think we need a 2-3 year break and then we will re-evaluate whether or not we want to return to Disney again.

Edited to add: Normally, we would have taken another Disney vacation this summer to maximize the use of our APs. But we are spending a week at another vacation destination instead. We are also not renewing our APs. So we are a very tiny reason the parks are less crowded.

Sounds like my family. We won't be renewing our APs. We've rented out most of our DVC points from this year and next year. We will go in January for a no park trip on DVC points. Until some park projects are finished we won't return. The value is not there. We will probably sell most of our 860 DVC points.

 

[jsrj21]

We are planning some all inclusive trips that are cheaper with WDW, including flights.

Same...While I love WDW, we will be heading to visit other destinations in the USA.... We have an 11 day trip in August but as I planned this trip, with all of the closures and construction, there's really slim pickings at HS which to me at least, creates larger crowds at the other attractions. Luckily, AK will be closing late now so we have that whole new experience.

So for as much as I love it, we will be taking a break from WDW for the foreseeable future after this trip until they at least finish all of the construction. Will surely be a sad day on the last day this year.....

 

[vinotinto]

Following...very interested in this topic and I have also been wondering the same.

I think Disney does a much better job staffing in the "high" season. Not long ago (first week of April), they got slammed with ridiculous wait times (I know, I was paying attention because it's our Spring break here in metro Atlanta). They cut down the staffing and it showed. But, it seems they staffed appropriately for summer. But what about the Fall? Will they understaff again?

 

[BookGirl305]

q

 

[midge3426]

This is the first year since 1993 that we are not going to Disney. Increased prices is just a small part of the reasons that we are not returning. For the past ten years, the prices go up and the services go down. There use to be a good reason to stay on site and to pay those awful, inflated prices for a hotel room. That is no longer the case. I no longer call housekeeping, mousekeeping, because, mostly, they do not deserve to be called by that moniker anymore. Due to budget cutbacks, you are lucky to even get your room half-way cleaned. The little perk of towel animals placed in your room is either rare or nonexistent........also enough towels. The bus system has gotten so bad that we take our own car to the parks. EMH is often crowded and too short. Also, they are not training their personnel adequately and is resulting in employees who are clueless and/or just rude (I must say that there are a few good cast members left).

The parks are suffering from negligence. The maintenance and cleaning are sorely lacking. Let's talk about planning-----preparing for the future......that's not good either. They have expanded Fantasyland, but it was not done well. And what about the disaster in front of the Castle. I much prefer the little lake instead of the formal landscaping placed in the area. It does not work, the space is too small and it looks like a bunch of postage thrown down in front of the castle. They are closing too many attractions at once and messing up the park flow. The new rides that have opened are half-way done, too short, and sometimes not appropriate for the area of the park. The executives need to sit down and
P-L-A-N. You need to have rides that last more than a few minutes after you wait an exorbitant amount of time to board. You need a mixture of long rides mingled in with short rides. And please, when you re imagine a ride, just don't throw up different theming in the same exact space. Spend some money. Disney certainly charges enough.

My rant is over. I just feel as though The Disney corporation no longer cares about their customers or the Walt Disney legacy. All they care about is the bonuses for the executives. This is an example of how poorly the personnel are now trained: We were on the tram returning to our car at Epcot. There were still a lot of people exiting the park. If you have been a lot to Disney, then you know you always exit on one side only of the tram (usually the left). The cast member stopped the tram in the back parking lot on the left and announced the stop. We and others remained on the tram because we were parked on the right side. The driver got on the mike again and told everyone that that was the last stop of the evening and that we better get off and that there would be no more trams for the rest of the evening. If you stayed on, then you are going to the tram parking area. We got off as did everyone else. My husband looked at me and said, "I have never seen this happen at Disney before. You always depart on one side."

 

[bksomody]

I've been watching lines since May to plan for a trip next year and noticed that May & June seemed much busier then July. I think people are taking their summer breaks earlier to try to avoid the heat, and hope to beat the summer crowds. Also, breaks have changed many schools are getting out earlier and having fall breaks . It use to be summer break started for us mid June but it has shifted to mid to late May.

If the reason is because of price increases then we should see the trend continue through out the year and I don't think it will but we'll see.

 

[bryanb]

My husband looked at me and said, "I have never seen this happen at Disney before. You always depart on one side."

I usually don't use the parking lots, but when I did last year, I do remember at least one stop where we exited on both sides. The announcer said that "X" is to your left and "Y" is to your right. I suppose that particular cast member didn't make that clear, in your case.

I didn't have any special comment (positive or negative) housekeeping services during my visit, but they were very friendly in the hallways. I haven't noticed a lack maintenance or cleanliness personally. I still felt this fantastic enjoyment of being in a different world.

I personally had a great time with the lower crowds this summer and thought most cast members were doing a great job.

But you've been going for a lot longer than I have, and I don't want to completely dismiss anything you saw that I missed. Overall, sorry you didn't have a good experience during your visit!

 

[geenerbell]

I don't think it's just Disney that's seeing a decrease. For example, after our Universal/Disney split stay June 14-19 we went to Hilton Head Island for two nights. It was strangely empty. Very little traffic and not busy at all. We kept saying "What is going on here?"

 

[oceanmarina]

I've been saying for a long time that it would hit a tipping point and perhaps that has happened? For a couple years people here on the DIS have been complaining about this, that and the other. And the answer is always "If you don't like it, don't go". I think a lot of those people love Disney and wanted to give it "one more chance". Well, a lot of those "one more chances" have come and gone. And cutting entertainment and park hours while substantially hiking prices to offset costs in Shanghai was perhaps a bridge too far for many.

I agree. I'm paying more for this trip than previous trips, DH is not happy about that at all. He says we may take a Disney break after this year. Also, I agree for what you pay for, little things like having your room adequately cleaned are an issue - and shouldn't be considering what you pay. I spoke to a few of the Mousekeeping staff on previous trips and they are stretched far to thin to be able to do their job well - not their fault, it's management.

 

[Mambo Junkie]

The scheduling really pushed us over the limit, it just doesn't seem worth the effort anymore. We ended up spending the last half of our fall 2014 trip at Universal and had a blast. Last year we decided to skip Disney altogether, do other things and re-evaluate. This year I start planning a fall trip and the kids just want more dark side. DW said she just wants to go to Uni, stay onsite and relax, no rushing. I kept pushing for a few Disney days and she just flat out told me she doesn't want to go to Disney at all this year, just too much hassle and not as much fun as it used to be. I priced out 3 days of Disney tickets, no hoppers, and it was actually more than our Universal AP's. Jeez. I started thinking about what we would actually do with those 3 days and realized I she was completely right.

Now after spending a few days on the Disboards catching up, I am totally down with just staying at the dark side the whole trip and relaxing. It reminds me of how our Disney trips used to be. I Booked HRH, bought AP's, done. No ride appointments, no ADR's, no itinerary in my pocket. Just show up and have fun. I doubt we will be back at Disney before SWL opens, maybe, but it will most likely be 1-2 day side trips to MK/EP vs. our old 8-10 day trips never leaving property. Kinda sad about it but life goes on and USO is doing a good job of scratching the itch right now.

Last visit, I was on the fence about getting APs for WDW and I procrastinated too long. So, we got APs for Universal instead. Way cheaper, and the number 1 reason we're going back in September. We still plan to go to WDW (Frozen, Soarin and hopefully ROL) but that's the main reason(s).

 

[Mambo Junkie]

I know it's not scientific at all, but my wife and I made an interesting observation in our trip we just made. We always like to look at the globe when we got off SE to see where people say they are from. Like I said, it's not scientific and by no stretch is it 100% accurate (our kids ride SE in their own car and more than once they have said we live in the Atlantic Ocean) but I do think it shows general trends. We rode SE at least 5 or 6 times between June 17th and July 3rd, it's one of my favorites. We were surprised at what the globe showed. There was a huge concentration of people from Florida with a trickle into south GA and Atlanta, and just as big of a concentration in the mid-Atlantic (PA, NJ, DE, MD). The rest of the US (and the world) was fairly sparsely lit up. In our experience, Florida and the PA area have always been the two highest concentrations listed, but what was notably different was the lack of dots in other places.

One thing I'd be curious about is are the hotels showing a similar decline in crowds? We never stay on property, so we have nothing to compare. But I do read how much it costs to stay on property, even at a "value" resort...which is part of why we don't do it. We can get a house for under $700/week and pack our own food. I wonder if more people will start doing this to save money for a WDW trip.

We are staying offsite for the first time in years.

 

[epcotty]

I think tiering the 1 day passes has lost a lot of people. Probably more than they intended to lose with doing that. We were there 2 weeks ago, just as a point of reference the highest wait time we saw at 7DMT was 80 minutes and it usually was below that (we passed it several times). And nothing else seemed too long either

 

[Accident]

I kind of ignored the whole thread but here is what I see happening....

1: Personal lives taking priority...

- really bad weather this year, biblical flooding, extreme highs.. people have to deal with their homes and lives
- the country has gone crazy.. so many shootings and man made disasters this year.. Is it safe to travel?
- is WDW safe? I hate to say it but that alligator incident I'm sure had a lot of people decide they would prefer somewhere else while it gets under control.
- Zika: is swamp and marshland safe to be in right now?
- recession: south america, au/nz, brexit, a lot of regulars to WDW just can't do it this year..

2: Being Nickle and Dimed..

- the increases are insane at disney this year so far. best discounts ever but you still have to eat and drink (yes I know ways to do that but does average not on this forum guest know that?)
- the line went to far and many just can't do it no matter how much they want too.
- disney has created a you better plan for 6 months or your not going to have fun mentality that the best discounts ever offered has people thinking you can't plan with this short notice if they even noticed the discounts because they probably booked somewhere else already.

3: Construction zone...

- the picture is painted that more is closed and not opened. not exactly true but things that should have opened failed too and it helps people decide that right now is not the time for WDW.
- things are coming.. This is going to be a huge part of it.. it's getting close enough to new things, mixed with the disney you better plan a year in advance precedent that people are waiting for it all to open and plan that massive visit with more money and going light on family vacations right now...
- if this is a once in a lifetime trip, they want everything opened and new things happening to be the best trip they will ever take.. (even though we all know they will be back but we all thought WDW was a once and done place).

And the real answer for what's going on...... It's a mixture of the above in everyones head... Disney's created a planning culture that can wait years to come while planning it out, it's starting to be felt.

I would be skipping the next year or three if I didn't move here.. I might head to other properties but I would probably head out to some other family favorites or bucket list destinations for now and wait until the 50th.