Paid FP options coming soon to WDW?

[memo10]

Personally, until another dreaded recession hits I don't see things changing at Disney other than going up, up, up!

This is what my husband and I believe too! I wonder if they’re doing all they can to pad the coffer before the next recession. Some analysts suggest it’s closer than not...

We’ve had passes since 2014, but we opted not to renew this year. It’s interesting to see how much it’s changed even in that short amount of time.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Everyone has a breaking point. I reached mine with my LSU football season tickets when they sent me the first part of my bill and it went UP. I'm done buying them after this season. It's not worth it to me anymore.

Until TONS of people reach that point they will continue to push the limits.

 

[snappy]

Yea we gave up Cali Grill and some other table service restaurants. Cost up, quality and portion size down. It was fun, moving along. Lots of other choices, including a grocery stop via a car service to be fixed in the kitchen at the villa. Healthier too!

 

[Moliphino]

ADRs are something of a red herring - you can change them without penalty and we often do. First when the park calendars shift between 180 and 60 days out. Later when we feel like eating somewhere else that day. Plus 180 days out for a dinner reservation *is* kind of insane - Disneyland is 60 days out.

That's very true. I can make ADRs on Monday, but the park calendar isn't even visible for my dates yet. And even when it is visible it's rarely accurate this far out.

 

[mshanson3121]

DisneyDremoves EMH hours and sells them now, people line up.

This one really amazes me. It is so expensive! You are paying for an hour and a half, and a mediocre breakfast. For curiosity sake I priced it - for a family of 4 it was going to be $350!! On top of the $400 we already had to pay to be in the park that day.

 

[Tiggerlover91]

That's very true. I can make ADRs on Monday, but the park calendar isn't even visible for my dates yet. And even when it is visible it's rarely accurate this far out.

I haven't had an ADR since 2001. My family started eating kosher around 2003 or 2004, so I stopped doing table service restaurants as I don't want microwaved meals at a sit down dinner. With that said, I've always wondered why DisneyWorld allows ADRs that far in advance....6 months. How does that help anyone when they don't even have park hours out that far. I think 30-45 days would be better? Yes?

 

[SaintsManiac]

This one really amazes me. It is so expensive! You are paying for an hour and a half, and a mediocre breakfast. For curiosity sake I priced it - for a family of 4 it was going to be $350!! On top of the $400 we already had to pay to be in the park that day.

It's easy for me to drop money on extras. We are only 3 people and I bought my APs months ago. Disney math is truly one of a kind.

 

[Tiggerlover91]

Disney removes EMH hours and sells them now, people line up.

They haven't completely removed them, but I can tell you in comparison to my trip in 2001, 2011 they aren't near as convenient on my park days as they used to be. I believe in 2015 we only did AK EMH because it was on a Sunday and that was our first park day so I moved AK to that day and MK to Monday. MK and EPCOT didn't have EMH mornings that worked with my trip. Guess what....they won't on my June trip either, but the EMH evenings do work out well, so I'll be doing the ones for EPCOT and MK while we are there.

As for paying for that now, I would, if I felt I could get more bang for the buck. I'm a FL resident, so it doesn't hurt my family as much paying for the norm ticket and then the EMM ticket. The DAH....now that would hurt a little more, but I am considering trying one of these when we return in 3-4 years. It's not in the budget for our June trip.

 

[chaoskids]

This one really amazes me. It is so expensive! You are paying for an hour and a half, and a mediocre breakfast. For curiosity sake I priced it - for a family of 4 it was going to be $350!! On top of the $400 we already had to pay to be in the park that day.

Tickets prices vary so widely from person to person. Some in our group have Gold AP and their cost per day is around $34 or $136 for a family of 4. A couple have long multi day passes and pay about $48 a day or $192 for a family of 4. It’s makes the price tag a little easier.

 

[firefly_ris]

They are expanding in every area so much (and building and refurbing in the parks like crazy), I'm not at all shocked they are looking for a revenue stream that will also try to tackle the line issue.

They are building a lot, but a lot of it is not a net positive gain... look at Future World -- they kept closing pavilions and not replacing them with anything for years and years (Wonders of Life, Horizons, etc). They're building Guardians but lose Energy. They're creating new stuff which is great, but not adding further capacity, just replacing stuff they tore down. And they are having to do it all in a big jumble now because they let the parks sit for like a decade (New Fantasyland excepted... which, meh). DHS gets lots of new work, but instead of just adding on they first tore down Lights, Motors, Action (a big people eater), Backlot Tour, GMR, etc. It's great they are building, but they are playing catch-up on things. Epcot gets Frozen but loses Maelstrom. The monorails have to have crap fall off of them before they are finally called to start discussing replacing those. I dunno. They should have been ahead of the game, instead of waiting until it got so monumentally crowded again -- but then I guess if they had done that, they couldn't use all the new build hype in their marketing. I have to hand it to them, they always know how to spin it back their way.

 

[Mome Rath]

They are building a lot, but a lot of it is not a net positive gain... look at Future World -- they kept closing pavilions and not replacing them with anything for years and years (Wonders of Life, Horizons, etc). They're building Guardians but lose Energy. They're creating new stuff which is great, but not adding further capacity, just replacing stuff they tore down. And they are having to do it all in a big jumble now because they let the parks sit for like a decade (New Fantasyland excepted... which, meh). DHS gets lots of new work, but instead of just adding on they first tore down Lights, Motors, Action (a big people eater), Backlot Tour, GMR, etc. It's great they are building, but they are playing catch-up on things. Epcot gets Frozen but loses Maelstrom. The monorails have to have crap fall off of them before they are finally called to start discussing replacing those. I dunno. They should have been ahead of the game, instead of waiting until it got so monumentally crowded again -- but then I guess if they had done that, they couldn't use all the new build hype in their marketing. I have to hand it to them, they always know how to spin it back their way.

To clarify what I meant above; Disney, the company as a whole, is expanding rapidly. Disney + is coming out, the acquisition of Fox, all the new movies, ESPN ap, plus all of the theme park side of things.

The parks did change a lot though; New Fantasyland, Pandora (heck AK itself), TSL, SW:GE, the restaurants that go along with it, hotels, Skyliner, hopefully new monorails as you mention, new nighttime shows made up of projections, fireworks, festivals, etc... The situation with DHS shifted greatly with Universal unveiling HP; Disney actually had to play catch-up for once, and the whole park had to be re-imagined, which put EPCOT on the back burner. There has been a ton of change, not all of it good, but for my family, it has been a net gain as we have been traveling since it was just MK and EPCOT. They have expanded capacity over the years, but with the economic growth and more and more people going to Orlando it's harder to keep up (let alone trying to compete with Netflix now and the other media empires).

I get why there are people "over" Disney, and I think that's fine. But, from a purely personal standpoint, my family looks forward to trips now just as much or more than in the past (and something new opening almost every year), paid FP isn't really going to change that I don't think. It may, we will just have to see.

 

[Remy is Up]

As with anything involving a vacation, it is a "personal" choice. The reality is people can complain, say its "unfair" etc. Unfair is the most overused term these days. Unfair is nothing more than a state of mind and what you believe you deserve in your own mind. There is no definition that is exact. Whether it be a recession that thins the crowds and makes the company revise their pricing or its the fact that crowds decline due to crossing the threshold of what people will and wont pay and what people consider a value or worthwhile excess spending of funds, they will continue to do what they do. Lets be realistic. NO company, Zero, nada, and if you mention one, step back because yes that one too, is out to make money and succeed, not make sure their customers get benefits from what they provide. They will always increase costs to end user in order to maximize profitability, and heaven forbid the product become a huge success. Those prices will dramatically increase. These companies like Disney are not providing necessities like Gas, Water, Food, Shelter, etc. They provide a service or product, in Disneys case, entertainment. And you can choose whether or not to partake. You can complain about their decisions all day. Go get a bus of people and raise banners outside the property complaining about policies and prices. It does NOTHING. So it comes down to personal choice. When on property resort prices are too high at a given time, I just dont stay on property. I stay off. I use bridging and the discount to make sure my AP renewal is as cheap as possible. I get TIW because I like a lot of the restaurants and then use the discount constantly. If I choose to do an after hours or party, then so be it. Depends on the value to me. But a change to the way FPs are done, and we dont even knwo what that change is yet, will be something that will go into my consideration of whether or nto we keep APs and TIW. Its my choice and they dont OWE me anything. So none of this stuff gets me uptight or bothered like so many people seem to get. Seems as if people think Disney owes you something, when in fact, they dont. If you dislike the policies or new prices, etc...Simple, use your $ to make a statement and dont go. Because otherwise it is hypocritical and you are spending money just to be able to complain. I can think of better things to do with my money.

 

[firefly_ris]

To clarify what I meant above; Disney, the company as a whole, is expanding rapidly. Disney + is coming out, the acquisition of Fox, all the new movies, ESPN ap, plus all of the theme park side of things.

Oh OK gotchya. I see what you mean there. That is all true. On the parks end, my thoughts still stand... give us new stuff, yes great, but don't just keep tearing everything else down too (and yeah... new fireworks shows are great, but remember when DHS and AK had parades? Still over time taking stuff away without replacement, for long stretches of time). If they really want crowd disbursement they build new things without getting rid of other stuff, and especially high capacity stuff. I still enjoy Disney, I was just there and had a nice time, but when I throw down 2 thousand dollars for a 6 day ticket for my family... more and more on top of that is not a pleasant thing and it does eventually sour people to the brand.

So none of this stuff gets me uptight or bothered like so many people seem to get. Seems as if people think Disney owes you something, when in fact, they dont. If you dislike the policies or new prices, etc...Simple, use your $ to make a statement and dont go. Because otherwise it is hypocritical and you are spending money just to be able to complain. I can think of better things to do with my money.

Disney owes me zero. We are in a strong economy, and so people keep willingly paying more for less. That's fine now, and Disney is a business. So they're going to do that. I think you get to a point where you start damaging the brand, and then, you hit a recession... it's hard to get those people back after that. I think they are way too short-term focused right now. But ultimately I'm just 1 peon and my dollars don't matter, but we're on a discussion board, so we discuss.

 

[snappy]

Oh OK gotchya. I see what you mean there. That is all true. On the parks end, my thoughts still stand... give us new stuff, yes great, but don't just keep tearing everything else down too (and yeah... new fireworks shows are great, but remember when DHS and AK had parades? Still over time taking stuff away without replacement, for long stretches of time). If they really want crowd disbursement they build new things without getting rid of other stuff, and especially high capacity stuff. I still enjoy Disney, I was just there and had a nice time, but when I throw down 2 thousand dollars for a 6 day ticket for my family... more and more on top of that is not a pleasant thing and it does eventually sour people to the brand.



Disney owes me zero. We are in a strong economy, and so people keep willingly paying more for less. That's fine now, and Disney is a business. So they're going to do that. I think you get to a point where you start damaging the brand, and then, you hit a recession... it's hard to get those people back after that. I think they are way too short-term focused right now. But ultimately I'm just 1 peon and my dollars don't matter, but we're on a discussion board, so we discuss.

I agree. Healthy discussion is well, healthy.

 

[wareagle57]

As with anything involving a vacation, it is a "personal" choice. The reality is people can complain, say its "unfair" etc. Unfair is the most overused term these days. Unfair is nothing more than a state of mind and what you believe you deserve in your own mind. There is no definition that is exact. Whether it be a recession that thins the crowds and makes the company revise their pricing or its the fact that crowds decline due to crossing the threshold of what people will and wont pay and what people consider a value or worthwhile excess spending of funds, they will continue to do what they do. Lets be realistic. NO company, Zero, nada, and if you mention one, step back because yes that one too, is out to make money and succeed, not make sure their customers get benefits from what they provide. They will always increase costs to end user in order to maximize profitability, and heaven forbid the product become a huge success. Those prices will dramatically increase. These companies like Disney are not providing necessities like Gas, Water, Food, Shelter, etc. They provide a service or product, in Disneys case, entertainment. And you can choose whether or not to partake. You can complain about their decisions all day. Go get a bus of people and raise banners outside the property complaining about policies and prices. It does NOTHING. So it comes down to personal choice. When on property resort prices are too high at a given time, I just dont stay on property. I stay off. I use bridging and the discount to make sure my AP renewal is as cheap as possible. I get TIW because I like a lot of the restaurants and then use the discount constantly. If I choose to do an after hours or party, then so be it. Depends on the value to me. But a change to the way FPs are done, and we dont even knwo what that change is yet, will be something that will go into my consideration of whether or nto we keep APs and TIW. Its my choice and they dont OWE me anything. So none of this stuff gets me uptight or bothered like so many people seem to get. Seems as if people think Disney owes you something, when in fact, they dont. If you dislike the policies or new prices, etc...Simple, use your $ to make a statement and dont go. Because otherwise it is hypocritical and you are spending money just to be able to complain. I can think of better things to do with my money.

I can't speak for others, but for me it's not a matter of it being "unfair." It's not a matter of me personally being priced out. Disney is free to do whatever they want. And as you said, every company is out to make a profit, and Disney is not exempt from that. But you're wrong that making the customer feel valued, and like they get their money's worth isn't one component of doing that. Some companies value that much higher than others and it is part of their business strategy.

I think for the most part, people complain about these things on here, not because we feel it is personally going to ruin our next trip, though I'm sure that's part of it. But a bigger reason is we feel like we as a community are somewhat of the "gatekeepers". Not that we have any real power to change anything, but if we don't notice and complain, then who will? We think certain things are a bad move for the company and will hurt the brand in the long run. The goal of a company is to make profits. But not at all costs.

 

[Grumpy6264]

It isn't necessarily about anything being unfair, for me it would be nice to be able to obtain the fast passes we want easily for everyday of our trips. Now, I know that is not the case and I understand all the reasons why.

It is just the nature of the beast. A trip to Disney is expensive and people want the most out of their time there. I think with the advanced planning and the sheer number of people there makes planning inherently tricky.

There is no easy answer, but it sure makes for entertaining reading.

 

[SG131]

I haven't had an ADR since 2001. My family started eating kosher around 2003 or 2004, so I stopped doing table service restaurants as I don't want microwaved meals at a sit down dinner. With that said, I've always wondered why DisneyWorld allows ADRs that far in advance....6 months. How does that help anyone when they don't even have park hours out that far. I think 30-45 days would be better? Yes?

30-45 would be better for some yes, but it is better for Disney to have people locked into their vacations ahead of time so that they can then judge what type of discounts they need to offer and what rooms they have available for 3rd party sites like priceline. That plus Disney's IT already fails when so many people log on at 180, if everyone logged on at 30 days including all the people that added a trip between 180 and 30 I'd say the site would really be useless!

 

[Miffy]

I think a great way for WDW to make more money--since this thread seems to be almost asking them to start charging their customers for things that are now free--would be if the WDW resorts would charge extra for every time you went into your room. I mean, after all, you're wearing out the technology each time you open the door and you're putting wear and tear on the door and hinges, etc. So I think maybe $5 each time you entered your room would probably do it. Similarly, they could put water meters in the rooms and charge for water use. Ditto electricity. How come WiFi is free? Nonsense. Charge for it. It's a necessary. No one is going to flinch over a charge like that. Instead of giving resort guests cash incentives to not use the housekeeping service, just charge everyone for it. You want housekeeping? Pay for it.

There are literally hundreds of other things WDW could be charging its customers for. Yes, I'm being sarcastic--especially about charging people to go in and out of their rooms--but I bet if WDW did institute policies like these, there'd be plenty of people here on the DIS who'd defend them.

Disney is a business. But one of the reasons they have me as a customer is that there's a tremendous amount of good will there, built up over the years. That is an important factor in any business that's not a monopoly. If people start perceiving Disney as greedy and nickel-and-diming and not caring--or not caring as much--for their customers, they could start losing customers in droves.

 

[Cinderumbrella]

Interesting conversation with longtime friends of ours.
Quick background: We all have teenage sons. 1 family has been to WDW and DL (but not in 5-6 years). Other family has never been to either.

They are planning a group vacation to Universal Orlando this July. This will be their 2nd trip together to USO in about 3 years. We declined because I am already booked at WDW this June (and now again for August for SW).

They both said we should just go with them to Uni instead because of Express Pass privileges for on site guests. They are done with endless lines at WDW (despite one being a big Star Wars fan). The teens are also done with “kiddie rides” at WDW.

In short, Disney needs to do something about the perception that it’s nothing but lines that USO clearly doesn’t have. At some point people will stop coming (or never come at all) if 180 minute waits become the norm for headliners.

 

[PrincessV]

As a WDW regular since 1990 (I'm local-ish), I've seen a LOT of changes over nearly 30 years. When I first started visiting regularly, I was young and broke - I mostly did day trips, and the occasional offsite stay of a night or two, I had a MK-only AP, and later added an EP After 4pm AP. When I started earning a bit more and had a little more disposable income, I was able to get a FL AP that had blockout dates, and I used WDW's really good FL/AP discounts to stay onsite a couple times a year. As finances further improved, I was able to stay onsite more often and for longer stays, moved up to a full-year AP, began exploring WDW's table service food scene, enjoyed some extra hard-ticket events, and eventually bought into DVC. Over the past decade or so, my income has continued to increase, albeit more slowly than it did at the beginning of my career, but it hasn't kept pace with WDW's costs. First I sold my DVC, then I downgraded my AP. I started staying offsite again, reduced the length and quantity of overnight stays, and cut back on TS meals. Today, I'm back to a Silver AP, very few overnight stays - mostly offsite, no hard tickets/extra cost entry/etc., one or two TS meals a year, and a general unwillingness and inability to spend any more than I absolutely have to to enjoy the parks.

I share this history because I really do not think I'm alone. While lots of folks have incomes that have kept up with WDW's special brand of inflation, I believe there are plenty of us whose income hasn't. I can't say that I think of it as "unfair." But it is disappointing. Frustrating. Sad. Confusing. If I look back I see sooooo many things that used to be free, or at least reasonably priced, that are now way outside my budget. I've dealt with that by focusing on what makes WDW a special, enjoyable destination for my family: the overall environment and the attractions we enjoy. In some ways, FP/FP+ helped us experience that enjoyment, and in others it took away some enjoyment, but overall, we've found ways to make FP work for us and fit into what I can afford.

IDK how a pay-to-play FP program will impact us. I can't pay for it, so the issue is mostly a matter of wondering how will others paying for it change how the parks work for me and my family. If it results in shorter standby waits, greater availability of same-day FPs, or even more FPs available at my 30-day window, that could be good for us. If it results in me not being able to ride anything without a 2-hour wait, the last thing available to me at my income/budget level will be gone. Again, I don't think that qualifies as "unfair," necessarily, but it could be a huge disappointment.