College entrance cheating scandal

[longboard55]

people hire consultants everyday. Thousands of people hire college consultants, golf consultants, financial consultants, exercise consultants. The consultant is expected to have inside information and contacts. Unless she specifically requested he break the law, hard to see where the feds have much of a case. I know this is fun, just do not see it. Our whole legal and political system is based on inside deals.

 

[cabanafrau]

people hire consultants everyday. Thousands of people hire college consultants, golf consultants, financial consultants, exercise consultants. The consultant is expected to have inside information and contacts. Unless she specifically requested he break the law, hard to see where the feds have much of a case. I know this is fun, just do not see it. Our whole legal and political system is based on inside deals.

If the Prosecutors feel like the case against the parents is vulnerable they could simply offer a deal sweetener to the ringleaders in exchange for testimony showing the parents were knowingly complicit. It won't be a get out of jail free card, but any room for improvement has to be preferable.

 

[Imzadi]

They can obviously afford the best lawyers money can buy. The trial will be interesting, that's for sure.

Yeah, if Johnny Cochran could say, "If the glove don't fit, you must acquit," and get OJ Simpson off, a well skilled lawyer, with a lot of audacity and snake oil to sell, might be able to get any client off.

One time, I got paid to be on a "mock jury trial" at a law firm as a juror. They were practicing their new junior & quite green lawyers on how to do jury trials. The lawyer totally went blank when it came to his summation. He stopped, paused for a good minute and a half, trying to compose himself, feeling horrible at the same time. And then when he began again, he was quite shaky.

The moderator asked us after the "trial" was all over, if the junior lawyer forgetting & getting flustered made any difference. I think all of us said no. We really felt for the guy. Yet, in the end, it was what what presented that counted. Yet, I added, if anything, it made me wonder what wasn't presented. What, if anything, wasn't this lawyer able to present? Or, that all 3 lawyers sitting on the other legal team, in their expensive suits, much older, and looking way more experienced, could spin or turn, as they were questioning a witness on the stand, that this new lawyer wasn't able to do (yet) as well? I said, Johnny Cochran, through his sheer years of being a confident litigator was able to get away with saying, "If the glove don't fit, you must acquit." Whereas someone new, would never be able to, and may lose their case because of it. It had less to do with the actual laws, but how a good, seasoned lawyer, might be able to turn the jury's thoughts and feelings by what they could present and HOW it is presented.


The biggest differences here are that this trial will be in MA, not CA. They may not be impressed with celebrities, the way juries seem to be in CA. And MA, last I was told, has the highest number of colleges of all the states. I would think, they are invested in making sure people will not even THINK about ways to get away with this again.

 

[Imzadi]

Unfortunately for them Prosecutors don't need information from them to make a case against the ringleader. That's a more typical way to get a plea deal, negotiate a sweeter plea deal.

Yes, I think after Lori & Mossimo didn't accept the original plea deal of 2 years in prison

they now have to go with Plan B and try to get a new plea deal that is less than 4 years, 9 months.

I think it's likely that Felicity Huffman will have served her 4 months (or whatever) and be back to her life, such as it is, before Lori & Mossimo's trials even begin.

Harvey Levin is speculating that the MA prosecutor really doesn't want to go to trial with any/all of these. That's why they toughened the crimes after the original plea deal wasn't accepted. That would be 50 trials that MA just doesn't have the manpower for. And these trials aren't rapes & murders that they need the manpower for.

 

[cabanafrau]

Yes, I think after Lori & Mossimo didn't accept the original plea deal of 2 years in prison

they now have to go with Plan B and try to get a new plea deal that is less than 4 years, 9 months.

I think it's likely that Felicity Huffman will have served her 4 months (or whatever) and be back to her life, such as it is, before Lori & Mossimo's trials even begin.

Harvey Levin is speculating that the MA prosecutor really doesn't want to go to trial with any/all of these. That's why they toughened the crimes after the original plea deal wasn't accepted. That would be 50 trials that MA just doesn't have the manpower for. And these trials aren't rapes & murders that they need the manpower for.

Sure, that's a huge volume of cases in one swing to add to the docket. Although these are federal charges, not state charges, so MA isn't on the hook. I have not paid attention to why they're being prosecuted in that district, likely related to the ringleader/origination point.

 

[longboard55]

I went to the college in the scandal. They are always asking for money. More money, better football tickets, better parties, fly on the team jet, get your name on a building. This is how private colleges work. Where do you draw the line. The schools employs dozens of fund raisers. It is very easy to assume this was a tool the athletic department used to raise money.

They are going after the wrong people, they should go after the insiders

 

[cabanafrau]

There's just one school in the scandal? I thought it stretched across several schools?

 

[Imzadi]

There's just one school in the scandal? I thought it stretched across several schools?

There are several schools involved. Not sure of the accuracy of my details: Yale rescinded admission to the one incoming student it knew about. They fired the coach/inside person involved. Several other schools either fired the coaches involved or the coaches voluntarily resigned after being uncovered. One was a long-time, very famous coach who lead his college team onto several past victories. They probably all have various charges against them. Those upcoming trials are just not as famous or getting news air times as the actresses.

 

[mom2rtk]

I went to the college in the scandal. They are always asking for money. More money, better football tickets, better parties, fly on the team jet, get your name on a building. This is how private colleges work. Where do you draw the line. The schools employs dozens of fund raisers. It is very easy to assume this was a tool the athletic department used to raise money.

They are going after the wrong people, they should go after the insiders

Have they offered to put your non-rowing kid on the crew team?

I also went to a high profile elite university (although not one that's part of the scandal). They are also constantly asking for money. Nowhere did I ever mistake that for them offering to admit my child. In fact, my one child that did apply there wasn't accepted.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I'm sure their legal team will blame the ringleader guy.

Good for them. I'm sure they contacted him, not the other way around. I wouldn't accept this defense.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Harvey Levin is speculating that the MA prosecutor really doesn't want to go to trial with any/all of these. That's why they toughened the crimes after the original plea deal wasn't accepted. That would be 50 trials that MA just doesn't have the manpower for. And these trials aren't rapes & murders that they need the manpower for.

Not Massachusetts court. Federal court in Massachusetts
The state isn't paying forvany of these trials.

 

[Imzadi]

Sure, that's a huge volume of cases in one swing to add to the docket. Although these are federal charges, not state charges, so MA isn't on the hook. I have not paid attention to why they're being prosecuted in that district, likely related to the ringleader/origination point.

Not Massachusetts court. Federal court in Massachusetts
The state isn't paying forvany of these trials.

My bad. Harvey only said the Prosecutor in MA. Didn't say if it was the state or federal. While he did say they don't have the manpower for 50 cases, I added on that these aren't rape or murder trials as these aren't heinous crimes like that.

 

[Boardwalk Jedi]

Every morning, I wake up and look at the news. Every morning, I ask myself "Can Lori Loughlin be a bigger idiot?"

 

[tex1989]

Strip what Huffman did down as much as you want. It is still a crime, money passed across state lines to commit fraud. That is a crime and can have the Ricco charges added which is basically if she made a phone call from one state to another then it's Ricco. The reality is they (the Parents) gave money to a third party acting as a non profit organization to commit fraud (test manipulation, entrance to schools under false circumstances etc.) and they did this with multiple conspiritors (people at the testing service, athletic coaches and insiders at the Universities) and they did it in multiple states hence Federal charges and the RIcco (organized crime across multiple states) charges that can be added. What is not known is if the Parents who paid the fees actually then turned around and tried to write those amounts off as donations to a 501 organization. That would add charges of tax evasion.

Bottom line is prosecuters have all the evidence they need to nail these people and the best course forward is to just take a plea and look for the best deal they can get.

 

[Searc]

Every morning, I wake up and look at the news. Every morning, I ask myself "Can Lori Loughlin be a bigger idiot?"

Seeing as her and her idiot husband are "outraged" they are being called cheaters, I'll take "yes" for $500, Alex.

 

[Imzadi]

Strip what Huffman did down as much as you want. It is still a crime, money passed across state lines to commit fraud. That is a crime and can have the Ricco charges added which is basically if she made a phone call from one state to another then it's Ricco. The reality is they (the Parents) gave money to a third party acting as a non profit organization to commit fraud (test manipulation, entrance to schools under false circumstances etc.) and they did this with multiple conspiritors (people at the testing service, athletic coaches and insiders at the Universities) and they did it in multiple states hence Federal charges and the RIcco (organized crime across multiple states) charges that can be added. What is not known is if the Parents who paid the fees actually then turned around and tried to write those amounts off as donations to a 501 organization. That would add charges of tax evasion.

Bottom line is prosecuters have all the evidence they need to nail these people and the best course forward is to just take a plea and look for the best deal they can get.

Did something new happen in her case? She already pled guilty a week or so ago.

Yet, you are right. A lot of people think what she did was worse than Lori Loughlin. She had standardized tests rigged with phony results.

 

[tex1989]

The prosecution got Felicity Huffman on mail fraud & tax evasion. Had she and the other parents indicted with her kept this "transaction" out of the mail, out of being wire tapped, and they somehow legally paid taxes on it, siting another reason to be paying the same amount, would they have gotten away with it?

My response about Huffman was answering this question.

 

[cabanafrau]

Strip what Huffman did down as much as you want. It is still a crime, money passed across state lines to commit fraud. That is a crime and can have the Ricco charges added which is basically if she made a phone call from one state to another then it's Ricco. The reality is they (the Parents) gave money to a third party acting as a non profit organization to commit fraud (test manipulation, entrance to schools under false circumstances etc.) and they did this with multiple conspiritors (people at the testing service, athletic coaches and insiders at the Universities) and they did it in multiple states hence Federal charges and the RIcco (organized crime across multiple states) charges that can be added. What is not known is if the Parents who paid the fees actually then turned around and tried to write those amounts off as donations to a 501 organization. That would add charges of tax evasion.

Bottom line is prosecuters have all the evidence they need to nail these people and the best course forward is to just take a plea and look for the best deal they can get.

Among those who have refused to enter into plea deals so far, I wonder if any have done so because their legal counsel has advised they can get the evidence, or significant portions of the evidence, thrown out? If so, I wonder if there is any validity to that advice?

Outside of that happening it seems like they must be rolling the dice on a dazzling display of litigation from their defense attorneys and/or a very fortunate streak of good luck in jury selection.

 

[tex1989]

Talk to any prosecutor or cop and they will tell you the reason they catch the bad guys is because someone always talks. The majority of convictions come because they get some evidence on one guy and then leverage into what they need to catch the rest. So take that theroy and apply it here. The creators of the scheme have plead guilty, many of the parents who paid for the services have plead guilty, there exists a large amount of evidence that can be substaintiated and those who have plead guilty can testify to the validity of that evidence.

At that point would you want to be the ones pleading innocent and hoping for a good outcome at trial? I would not want to be that person.

I can see no reason at this point why you would hold out and just go ahead and have your attorney cut the best deal you can get.

 

[Imzadi]

"And that Loughlin-less scenario has come to pass. The remaining season 6 installments have been re-edited in such a manner that removes any appearances by Loughlin, a source close to the show tells EW.

Removing Loughlin from the majority of the season required some highly creative editing, as well as some minor reshoots. As a result, one fewer episode will be offered in season 6, which means viewers will receive six episodes instead of seven."

https://ew.com/tv/2019/04/10/when-calls-the-heart-season-6-resumes-without-lori-loughlin/

I was watching a Hallmark movie last nite called, "Bottled In Love." At the beginning of the movie, the female star walks into the Boston Rowing Club!

I'm pretty sure they filmed this a couple months before the scandal broke. Yet, it's such an odd coincidence that the case is in MA and Lori faked her 2 daughters' profiles to be rowers. I wonder if Hallmark re-shot that one scene to give a nod that they agree with the lawsuit and not with Lori.

Anyway, Erin Krakow appeared in a commercial announcement during the movie, saying, yes, as we already know, One Calls the Heart, will be back in May, starting with a 2-nighter. Erin then announced the show has already been picked up for Season 7. Probably so many people writing in, wondering what was going to happen to their show let Hallmark know how many people are vested in it.