Enormous Dude

[Capang]

Read the first line of the link you posted. Any customer that encroaches on any part of neighbors seat....the arm rest are the boundaries. Meaning if you over flow the arm rests even if they come down, you are encroaching on your neighbors seat and need to purchase a second. Heck I can zip up a size eight pair of jeans but given the amount of excess body material coming out of the top of jeans I would be lying if I said I was a size eight.
Just because you can somehow squeeze yourself into a too small space doesn't mean you fit into it

They only look at if the armrest can go down. That is their boundary. It does not matter to them if you flow over the boundary. Just as long as you can get the armrest down. It is misleading.
Eta: I didn't say it was right. SW needs to clarify or stick to their policy. If there was no other seats available and that armrest could get down SW does not care for your comfort. They only care about your wallet.

 

[Capang]

I'm not sure why the people at the check in desk or boarding gate can't make sure a person of significant size hasn't purchased the required two seats. It doesn't sound like this was a case of someone who was just a bit overweight. Screening before boarding would prevent problems on board.

SW does not require a large person to purchase extra seats. If the plane is not full the extra seats will be given freely at the gate. Why pay upfront, even if you get reimbursed, when you could only pay for one seat? Again, not right but the rules can be applied that way. I am a large person. I make sure to know seat dimensions and airline rules when flying. I have flown SW before. Their seats are small. That's why I don't fly them anymore. It's as much for my comfort as for yours. However, I am nowhere near 350-400 like the person sitting near op. If someone is truly that large I'm sure the attendants at the gate could have discreetly handled the situation more so than just allowing the guy on the plane in one seat. I'm sure he was miserable, too. That doesn't mean everyone else needs to be miserable. If I didn't live so far from wdw I would never fly again. I was lucky enough to travel the world when air travel was still enjoyable.

 

[Gracie09]

They only look at if the armrest can go down. That is their boundary. It does not matter to them if you flow over the boundary. Just as long as you can get the armrest down. It is misleading.
Eta: I didn't say it was right. SW needs to clarify or stick to their policy. If there was no other seats available and that armrest could get down SW does not care for your comfort. They only care about your wallet.

And that is why I advised the OP to seek assistance from the FA in his case. It is a safety issue (he was unable to unbuckle his seat. IF there had been an emergency he could have been trapped) as well as a comfort issue. My DH is 6'7" with a 40 inch inseam. He does not fit in most airlines coach seats. We purchase extra leg room or upgrade our seats to first/business class when he flies. There is no option for him to purchase or reserve the seat in front of him. Southwest will give overweight customers the seat next to them for free! You are reimbursed for the seat, even if the flight is sold out.
If someone was halfway into my seat, I would raise holy hell before I attempted to wedge myself in. I don't care if they are embarrassed. They should be the adult and take responsibility for themselves.

 

[Capang]

And that is why I advised the OP to seek assistance from the FA in his case. It is a safety issue (he was unable to unbuckle his seat. IF there had been an emergency he could have been trapped) as well as a comfort issue. My DH is 6'7" with a 40 inch inseam. He does not fit in most airlines coach seats. We purchase extra leg room or upgrade our seats to first/business class when he flies. There is no option for him to purchase or reserve the seat in front of him. Southwest will give overweight customers the seat next to them for free! You are reimbursed for the seat, even if the flight is sold out.
If someone was halfway into my seat, I would raise holy hell before I attempted to wedge myself in. I don't care if they are embarrassed. They should be the adult and take responsibility for themselves.

Agreed. That person could have avoided the whole mess by reserving a second seat. Takes away embarrassment and adds to their comfort and safety as well as everyone else's. SW is a budget airline. They will not enforce the matter if the armrests go down because then they can sell that second seat. Other airlines are stricter with their policies because they will not refund the second seat for a larger person. They still get their money whether you take up one seat or three. Again, I'm not saying it's right, but challenging a flight attendant on a plane about their policies gets you kicked off a plane.

 

[ibob52]

I found this info via [google]

https://www.southwest.com/html/customer-service/extra-seat/index-pol.html

 

[Capang]

I found this info via [google]

https://www.southwest.com/html/customer-service/extra-seat/index-pol.html

Thanks, I already added that earlier in the thread. Also, look at the question here about seatbelt extenders. Buried in that question is the answer to the debate about flowing over the seat.
https://www.southwest.com/html/customer-service/faqs.html?topic=extra_seat_policy
As long as the armrests are down, no second seat is necessary even if overflow into the neighboring seats.

 

[Gracie09]

Agreed. That person could have avoided the whole mess by reserving a second seat. Takes away embarrassment and adds to their comfort and safety as well as everyone else's. SW is a budget airline. They will not enforce the matter if the armrests go down because then they can sell that second seat. Other airlines are stricter with their policies because they will not refund the second seat for a larger person. They still get their money whether you take up one seat or three. Again, I'm not saying it's right, but challenging a flight attendant on a plane about their policies gets you kicked off a plane.

Too bad so sad for them. I'm sorry but my husband has zero control over his height and he is penalized monetarily. An overweight person has control of their weight. If someone is removed from a plane because the person next to them is too fat to fit in their seat I would hope they went to social media and the news. When my husband was almost denied boarding he was monetarily compensated for the inconvenience because the airline and the other passenger screwed up. I would invite the head fa and captain to visit my seat and have them explain how I am supposed to fit in the half a seat I had left. This whole we don't want to embarrass people business has gone too far. You know when you are the size of the person in the op that you do not fit in an airline seat. It's personal responsibility and common courtesy, things that people lack.
And the term used is the armrests are the defining boundary, meaning they are the limits of the seat. Don't fit In The seat buy another.

 

[Gracie09]

Thanks, I already added that earlier in the thread. Also, look at the question here about seatbelt extenders. Buried in that question is the answer to the debate about flowing over the seat.
https://www.southwest.com/html/customer-service/faqs.html?topic=extra_seat_policy
As long as the armrests are down, no second seat is necessary even if overflow into the neighboring seats.

it says the armrests are the defining boundary meaning the limits of the seat. It doesn't say you can squeeze ten pounds of potatoes I. The five pound bag as long as you can put the arm rests down

 

[Capang]

Too bad so sad for them. I'm sorry but my husband has zero control over his height and he is penalized monetarily. An overweight person has control of their weight. If someone is removed from a plane because the person next to them is too fat to fit in their seat I would hope they went to social media and the news. When my husband was almost denied boarding he was monetarily compensated for the inconvenience because the airline and the other passenger screwed up. I would invite the head fa and captain to visit my seat and have them explain how I am supposed to fit in the half a seat I had left. This whole we don't want to embarrass people business has gone too far. You know when you are the size of the person in the op that you do not fit in an airline seat. It's personal responsibility and common courtesy, things that people lack.
And the term used is the armrests are the defining boundary, meaning they are the limits of the seat. Don't fit In The seat buy another.

It has nothing to do with embarrassment on SWs part. They want to sell every seat. If they reimburse for a larger persons seat they lose the profit on that seat. Also, it's the ability of the armrest to be lowered as stated here:

Our policy does not focus on weight, and the seatbelt extension is not the determining factor. We use the ability to lower the armrests as the gauge, as the armrests are truly the definitive boundary between each seat. Only one seatbelt extension may be used and only seatbelt extensions provided by Southwest Airlines are approved for use onboard our aircraft.

"The ability to lower armrests as the gauge..." Straight from SW website faqs. If that armrest goes down they can sell the extra seat and not reimburse or give it up to a larger person for free. I'm not saying it's right but if you don't like it fly a different non budget airline with stricter rules. Although, most airlines use the rule about the armrest going down as their deciding factor. If you are disgusted by others encroaching on your space, and one doesn't need to be large to have this happen with such small seats, you could always purchase a second seat for your comfort. If you don't like the rules don't fly.

 

[LisaS]

As long as the armrests are down, no second seat is necessary even if overflow into the neighboring seats.

The webpage at the link you provided also states that if a passenger encroaches upon any portion of the adjacent seat, they may want to book an additional seat:

How do I know if I need a second seat?

The armrest is the definitive gauge for a Customer of size. It serves as the boundary between seats; the width between armrests measures 17 inches. Customers who are unable to lower both armrests and/or who encroach upon any portion of the adjacent seat may proactively book the number of seats needed prior to travel or receive a complimentary additional seat.

 

[seashoreCM]

As long as the armrests are down, no second seat is necessary even if overflow into the neighboring seats.

However (according to Southwest's page on customers of size) its policy is designed to protect the comfort and safety of all customers.
So Southwest can be expected to free up seats, including by using its bumping rules, and including not receiving revenue for one or more seats, so that this policy functions as designed.

Can you (Southwest) ensure no one takes the seat beside me if I've secured a second seat?

"No, but you, the customer, can by simply occupying part of it!"

 

[Gracie09]

It has nothing to do with embarrassment on SWs part. They want to sell every seat. If they reimburse for a larger persons seat they lose the profit on that seat. Also, it's the ability of the armrest to be lowered as stated here:

Our policy does not focus on weight, and the seatbelt extension is not the determining factor. We use the ability to lower the armrests as the gauge, as the armrests are truly the definitive boundary between each seat. Only one seatbelt extension may be used and only seatbelt extensions provided by Southwest Airlines are approved for use onboard our aircraft.

"The ability to lower armrests as the gauge..." Straight from SW website faqs. If that armrest goes down they can sell the extra seat and not reimburse or give it up to a larger person for free. I'm not saying it's right but if you don't like it fly a different non budget airline with stricter rules. Although, most airlines use the rule about the armrest going down as their deciding factor. If you are disgusted by others encroaching on your space, and one doesn't need to be large to have this happen with such small seats, you could always purchase a second seat for your comfort. If you don't like the rules don't fly.

Actually you can't just buy a second seat if you wish too. We tried so that the seat in front of dh would remain empty and the seat back up as his knees tend to be in the back of most seats. We were told by multiple airlines that you can buy the seat next to you if you are overweight and can't fit in one seat but you cannot buy the seat in front of you if you are too tall. You are welcome to upgrade to first/business class (at the cost of more than two coach seats of course).
We don't fly sw with my husband as they don't offer any seats that have the leg room he needs. So something he has no control over costs us a lot of extra money and usually I end up in coach with our dds and he flies first class so we don't even sit near each other, but if you are overweight you get that second seat no problem!
If by your logic, sw only cares about making a dollar why even give the seat away for free? There is no rule that they have too.

 

[piccolopat]

SW does not require a large person to purchase extra seats. If the plane is not full the extra seats will be given freely at the gate. Why pay upfront, even if you get reimbursed, when you could only pay for one seat? Again, not right but the rules can be applied that way. I am a large person. I make sure to know seat dimensions and airline rules when flying. I have flown SW before. Their seats are small. That's why I don't fly them anymore. It's as much for my comfort as for yours. However, I am nowhere near 350-400 like the person sitting near op. If someone is truly that large I'm sure the attendants at the gate could have discreetly handled the situation more so than just allowing the guy on the plane in one seat. I'm sure he was miserable, too. That doesn't mean everyone else needs to be miserable. If I didn't live so far from wdw I would never fly again. I was lucky enough to travel the world when air travel was still enjoyable.

Then perhaps that is the problem. I also don't think this person could have sat down and then lowered the armrests which seems to be the measurement of whether another seat is needed. It sounds more like he plopped down and whatever oozed into the seat between the armrests went there and all the excess spilled over to his neighbor's seat. He should not have been allowed to fly if a second seat was not available. Too much political correctness in this country prevents real issues like this from being addressed. It was simply not fair to OP that SW allowed this situation and he should be reimbursed for the flight.

 

[Capang]

Then perhaps that is the problem. I also don't think this person could have sat down and then lowered the armrests which seems to be the measurement of whether another seat is needed. It sounds more like he plopped down and whatever oozed into the seat between the armrests went there and all the excess spilled over to his neighbor's seat. He should not have been allowed to fly if a second seat was not available. Too much political correctness in this country prevents real issues like this from being addressed. It was simply not fair to OP that SW allowed this situation and he should be reimbursed for the flight.

Agreed. As someone stated above it is also about personal responsibility. If you know your size is an issue make arrangements in advance, no matter what rules allow you to skirt the issue.

 

[ibob52]

It was simply not fair to OP that SW allowed this situation and he should be reimbursed for the flight.

 

[Gary M]

This is the reply I received from SWA. Someone questioned my honesty by saying bulkhead seats arm rest don't lift up. I know mine did, but I asked SWA to confirm that my arm rest lifted and it was confirmed, mine did. I've been on the DIS for over 15 years and wonder how "know nothings", question peoples stories. An individual didn't think the Enormous Dude could get between me and the bulkhead wall, have they ever set in a bulkhead seat? He did get by me and the wall. Another said I could unlock my seat belt because the seat belt buckle was in the middle of a persons lap. All seat belts that I remember, fasten toward my side and not in the middle. Maybe real tiny people have a seat belt fasten in the middle. My seat belt wasn't easy to unlock because his bulk was over the snapped in device. Over the years I have seen so many people put their two cents worth in on something they have no idea about or have experienced. I'm thin skinned and will now go back to not posting.

Dear Gary,

Thank you for taking the time to reach out to us with regard to your less than pleasant experience traveling to Orlando on December 6. I appreciate the opportunity to respond to your concerns.


Our Customer of size policy is designed to ensure the Safety and comfort of all Customers onboard our flights. We know that this can be a very sensitive topic for our Customers and Flight Attendants to address once onboard the aircraft, which is why our Ground Operations personnel should address these situations prior to boarding the aircraft. If our Flight Attendants are aware that a Customer may require an additional seat(s), they should contact station personnel to make arrangements to allow the Customer of size to occupy two seats prior to takeoff. We’re sorry if this was not your experience in Indianapolis and for any discomfort you experienced, especially if it affected your vacation to Disney World.


Additionally, according to the information available to us, the armrest on the seat you occupied onboard Flight #150 would have been movable (this feature does vary throughout the 737 series). Although Customers may choose any available seat and are able to move to a different seat any time that the “fasten seatbelts” sign is not lit, we understand that this was an uncomfortable situation for you, and sincerely apologize if you felt we could have done more to ensure your comfort. Please know that your feedback has been made available to our Senior Leaders via our monthly summary.


Retaining your future patronage is very important to us and we’d like to invite you back for a better experience soon. To that end, as a gesture of goodwill, we’ve issued you a $150.00 Southwest LUV Voucher which will arrive via email within 30 days. Instructions for use will be printed on the voucher.


We know that this situation remains troubling for you, and we wish that there was a way we could undo your disappointment. You have our word that we will continue to do our very best to meet (and exceed) your expectations as nothing would please us more than to share the skies with you for many years to come.






Sincerely,

Ashley Egan, Southwest Airlines

 

[North of Mouse]

Sorry for all the grief you have taken from those that 'know all' about 'all', no matter what it is. But, there were also plenty posters that were empathetic to your plight, and we 'did' support you!!

Glad you followed through with a letter to SW. Maybe that will make them a little more thorough in vetting people for 'seat size' before boarding - hopefully!

Don't give up on posting - no matter online, or in real life, you 'will' meet the type people that feel only 'they' are right, and no one else is correct - just develop a little thicker skin and let their words roll off!!

[/QUOTE]

 

[North of Mouse]

.

 

[Lisaloo]

Ugh. The larger people get the more I hate to fly. I don't know how much good it would have done, but I would have immediately pointed out the encroachment to a flight attendant. Buy a second seat if you are going to ooze into the one beside you.

 

[1girln3boys]

Sw policy is if someone does not fit in their own seat with both arm rests down they need to purchase a second seat. They then get on with early boarding to get the two seats together. If the flight is not sold out they are reimbursed for their seat (this varies by airline). Once it was apparent he could not fit in his seat I would have asked to speak with the head fligh attendant and quietly explain the situation. If they did not resolve the situation you can escalate.
I'm sorry this happened to you. It happened to my husband on JetBlue but it was made worse because JetBlue escorted the person on the plane so they knew she did not fit in her seat. Their solution was to send my husband on the next flight in two hours (not an option since we were traveling. With our kids and into Newark at night and our car was offsite. I would have had to sit in baggage claim until he arrived). It was only resolved by a stranger who saw what was going on and offered my husband his seat.

I had no idea about that policy. Wish I had. I between my husband who is 6'4" and a guy who couldn't put down the arm rest. So I was crammed between the 2 of them. My husband got on 1st bc he's A list preferred. When the other guy got on my husband told him that I would be sitting in the middle seat. The guy still sat there. I told my husband after that experience I would never do that again. I should have sat behind my husband or something instead of between the 2.