Howie's Angels

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by DisneyKidds


Isn't it unfair to those that don't have the advantage of being able to pay more?

If you can pay more you get an advantage.
If you have a computer and know about a website you can get an advantage.
If you are a 20 year old from Georgia you can get an advantage. (BTW - if I took home $58 mil after taxes I'd buy you all a breakfast at CRT - if I could only get a @#$%^ PS for 100)

That leads to an interesting question. If I offered you the breakfast but Howie got the PS would you take it? But, I digress.

There are all different kinds of advantages (and evils, depending on how you view things ) and people use them all the time. Does that make everyone wrong?

I doubt Howie tilts the playing field as much as some imagine.

Level playing field. Did we get back to debate about a utopian society?

Yes I do agree with you on the playing field..It can't be level ...I think I may have said something along those lines? There are many people that don't even get to go to Disney...I did not until I was 27 years old. Is that fiar? Heck if I could I would buy the world a Coke and a smile. I personally have no intrest in eating in the Castle. There are plenty of people that do though. The world is not fair yes I know this..but should someone go out of the way to make it unfair ? This is what he is doing...he is stealing from one person and giving it to another. Why does he get to do this? Who give him the Power to decied between little girl#1 and little girl#2? Until Howie came along its was basically as fair as it could be. Reguardless if you think he is tilting the playing field a little or alot he is still doing it.

 

[Braque]

d-r, it is worth the effort. Especially if you have little girls. Even without kids, looking at it subjectively the setting is very nice, it is more intimate than other Character Meals. You have some space around your table and the room is not packed with people. CRT is all 'face' characters so the interaction, I feel, is unique. It''s a wonderful way to start a MK day (if you're not going "Commando"). And the food is pretty good.

We have gone twice, and I was successful in getting PS's each time - on my own. (It was a proud moment ~sniff~)

 

[raidermatt]

I did MK "commando" one time. Ahhh, those afternoon breezes.....

But I digress.



Most people understand the playing field is not level. With respect to CRT, if you have multiple lines with auto re-dial, you have an advantage. If you live on the West Coast, you have to start calling at 4am, which for most is a disadvantage. But most people undersand these types of differences, as well as differences in what they can afford to purchase.

What most find objectionable in this case is that the outcome is being determined by an outside group of people. Disney set-up a process that is fair, given the above parameters. However, now, somebody is manipulating that system for financial benefit, and most guests don't even know it. Its easy enough to stop, so it should be stopped.

 

[DisneyKidds]

We'll keep this discussion on CRT, but given a couple comments about wanting to eat there let's argue (oops! I mean discuss ) another aspect, regardless of whether Howie gets the ressie or not.

We go to CRT. We have a 3 yo DD who adores the Princesses. Honestly, our hands are tied. Going makes her too happy.

However...... other than watching our DD's eyes light up when she sees the Princesses, the place sucks.

Can I say that? Will I be banished from the kingdom for doing so ?

The food is terrible compared to some of the great breakfast food you can get at other character meals. Pre-plated scrambled eggs, shriveled (sp?) sausage, spicy (and not good IMO) home fries, so so fruit, ok danish. The only saving grace is the cream cheese stuffed french toast - if you like that sort of thing. To be honest, the Princesses come around once and barely interact, and then they rush you out.

Every time we get done eating there we say we aren't going back. Then we start planning the next trip, we think about how much our DD liked it - and it's 6:58 at 60 days out on the phone for us.

IMO, parents will do anything for their little princesses, including sit through this monstrosity of a breakfast. Now, if they are willing to do that is it any surprise most will use whatever leverage they can get in obtaining a PS?

CRT lovers flame away .

 

[LAinSEA]

what a refreshing, adult, insightful discussion!

as a sociology minor in college - oh too many years ago - this is a great case study.

my two cents: everyone wants to feel special - that is why we pay for special clubs, privileges, and hope for an upgrade to concierge when we've booked and paid for standard views. Could happen, right?

the problem as I see it is that WDW knows it has the hottest ticket in town in CRT and part of keeping it the hottest ticket in town is limiting access so to speak in holding the princess breakfast exclusively in the castle. If I were part of the WDW think tank, I'd find a way to spread the face characters around at other parks and resort meals - especially the "princesses". more kids and kids at heart could and would enjoy character meals and as a result WDW would make a larger profit.

in the meantime, WDW has a public relations nightmare in the making with CRT and Howie's "solution". requiring a credit card is one solution, offering CRT 30 days earlier to on-site resort guests might be another, or perhaps no PS required would be the best solution - everyone would run to the castle instead of splash mountain and wait in line.

-LA

 

[DisneyKidds]

I can see the headlines now (which would definitely make 'Disney News') - worse than a football match in England....

...The Princess of Puyallup and five others were injured today in the 'Happiest Place on Earth' during an early morning melee to hold court with Cinderella and her esteemed associates. The fracas began when a large group of royal subjects grew impatient awaiting the official banquet hour at Cinderella's castle. Shortly before 8:00 am, several people were crushed against the rope holding the crowd at the end of Main Street USA as the raucus crowd behind started pushing toward the castle. When the Magic Kingdom cast members dropped the rope to signal the assault on the castle, two unwitting employees were trampled by the ensuing mob. On the way over the bridge leading to the castle one individual was tossed into the moat. The Princess of Puyallup suffered a srained knee as she was tripped by another overzealous subject as the two approached the podium to obtain a table for the elusive breakfast. Fortunately, none of the injuries are considered serious. This is the fifth time in as many days that injuries have been reported in the Magic Kingdom, following the discontinuation of priority seating and the use of first come first served seating at Cinderellas Royal Table....

If they do change anything I hope it is to take credit cards .

 

[DNSDisney]

Personally I think the best thing we can do is to continually write to disney guest relations until this matter has been handled and it is no long happening.
I like many others have gotten the standard "We are working on it" reply .
I believe they are hoping it will die down and they can pretend it isn't happening again.
We need to continue to write in masses to get anything done.
Just my .02

 

[HorizonsFan]

I sent an email voicing my concerns.
For what it's worth, here's the reply...

Dear Mr. (Horizonsfan),

Thank you for contacting WALT DISNEY WORLD!

Your concerns in reference to Cinderella's Royal Table Character Breakfast are
welcome. The WALT DISNEY WORLD Leadership Team is aware of this website and is
in the process of reviewing this information and formulating a strategy to
address this concern.

If you have questions or need further assistance, feel free to contact us.

Please include your full name, E-Mail address, and reservation number if
applicable on all correspondence.

Thank you!

Sincerely,

Linda Smith

Online Guest Service
WALT DISNEY WORLD
P.O. Box 10100
Lake Buena Vista FL 32830-0100

 

[LAinSEA]

...The Princess of Puyallup and five others were injured today in the 'Happiest Place on Earth' during an early morning melee to hold court with Cinderella and her esteemed associates.

I'm so glad to know I only sustained a sprain...LOL

(It's sooo hard to be sarcastic in text.)

A priority seating is for when you want to eat at a restaurant. If you have no intention to eat at the restaurant, then you should not make a priority seating.

and I have to agree, but wouldn't that actually be a reservation? By definition, a PS is just holding your place in line...much like fast pass, you show up at your appointed PS time and you are suppose to get the next available table for your party's size.

We plan to dine at the "flowers brunch" Mom's day weekend and for that "reservation" we had to use a credit card (and it will be charged if we change our minds and do not cancel). Given that CRT is the much sought after "PS" why not make it a reservation? If it were truly a PS then those without PS's would be able to get "in line" at the castle and not be turned away by the CMs because they are "all sold out".

An idea for WDW dining: bring back the "villians dinner" with a twist...a character lunch in the castle and they can take the "princesses" hostage right at change from breakfast to lunch!

-LA

 

[Planogirl]

I think that it's a great idea to change CRT to a reservation system! But then also allow a certain period of time to pay for the reservation for those that don't use CCs.

I just don't understand why Disney doesn't expand this breakfast? They certainly have far more demand than supply and why they don't correct that inequity boggles my mind. Is it truly so hard to find people to play the princesses and princes?

 

[LAinSEA]

I remember someone posting about "face characters" - Disney doesn't want someone seeing "Jasmine" in the morning and then running in "Jasmine" with a different face later in the day. I would think that it makes for a very long day for the "face character".

Perhaps they could spread the "face characters" around a little though - Cindy & Co from "Cinderella" at the castle; Jasmine, Aladin & Co from "Aladin" at another park or MK restaurant...etc.

I do realize that there are a great number of character meals at WDW - but very few are themed in the way that CRT is.

If only the DISers "ruled the world",
-LA

 

[madaboutMickey]

This is my understanding of the character situation regarding lunch and dinner at the castle. Yes, it's true that Disney doesn't want children to see one Jasmine in the morning and someone else as Jasmine in the afternoon. But only 1 character such as Mickey can be in any given park at any given time. You can't have Mickey at toontown and appearing on Main street at the same time. Cinderella can't be in the castle for late lunch and on a float in the parade at the same time. Why? Because there is ONLY one Mickey, Cinderella, Minnie, tigger, you name it. At least that's what I've been told by entertainment CMs. It's not like having a santa on every corner or it every store. It's part of the MAGIC.

 

[lrodk]

We will also live up to the falsehoods of the newspaper article. Specifically the allegations that we block out all seats and dole them out to whomever we wish. My nemesis should be careful what is wished for, as the worst thing I can do, is grant it. This policy change is not permanent. Exactly 30 days after the last hater leaves our website, and all hateful action, be it email, post, review, etc., ceases, we will return to our usual self imposed restrictions; it is there where magic lives and spreads.
Until then, Cinderella's Breakfast belongs to us.

We are going to rock your world!

This Howie character is no "Angel", that's for sure. You'd think his life revolved entirely around Cindy PSs. Very sad, and very unhealthy. I feel sorry for the chap.

 

[All Aboard]

lrodk, I'm not sure that post is from Howie. It's from someone who goes by the monicker "drv". I read through his responses to folks who disagreed with him... just simply amazing that there are folks like him out there. It's breakfast for crying out loud, he makes it out to be life and death.

madaboutmickey...

watch Spectro from Liberty Square and turn around and look in a window of the Liberty Tree Tavern... uh oh, two Goofys!!!

 

[lrodk]

Thank you for the clarification gcurling. If it's not Howie sending out this message then I apologize to him. But if this drv charcter is one of his Angels then I stand by my original assessment.

 

[HorizonsFan]

Actually, DrV is the site administrator; Howie is a moderator on the Breakfast Club board. As far as I have seen, Howie has been very civil in all his posts. DrV spews venom on a regular basis.

 

[Janet2k]

The Orlando Sentinel article states:
- - - - - - -
“Ditchek claims Walt Disney World supports what he is doing. But Rena Callahan, a Disney World spokeswoman, said ‘there is no relationship, professional or cooperative,’ between them.”
- - - - - - -

If that is true, then how come the Breakfast Club has a press release type of statement written by “Chatsworth” (that person seems to be one of their Webmasters) on 4/15/2002 that states the following:
- - - - - - -
“Thanks in large part to the wonderful efforts of our good friends on the RADP (rec.art.disney.parks) newsgroup, the Disney Company became aware of our cozy little corner of the web, and our contact was mutually beneficial. They informed us that our figures are slightly off. We had previously reported that we were helping Members secure 30 of 600 available seats each morning. Disney has shared with us that the maximum booking for Cinderella's Royal Table (CRT) breakfast can be as high as 900 seats each day (some tables accommodating five seatings), with a daily average of about 750 seats.
Our percentage of reserverations secured for Members who requested our help is much smaller than we had previously calculated.
But not for long.
We will be working directly with the Disney Company to help them ensure full tables every morning, by rebooking cancellations as they are released. And in return they will be helping us with anything we need to make magic come true for families just like yours!”
- - - - - - -

So, does Disney or does Disney not have a special relationship with that website regarding Cinderella’s Royal Table breakfast Priority Seatings?

 

[Mickeyworker]

Does anyone really believe anything they have read on the boards under discussion?

Why do you believe they (board) has a cozy relationship with Disney. We never tell
anyone what attendence, dining, etc. figures are.

Also, I take exception to some of the calculations I have read, about the number of
seats/Priority Seatings, available each morning. Think about this:

Breakfast is served from 8:05 am to 10:00 am (1 hour and 55 minutes). According to
some of these calculations they have the tables turning over 3-4 times during this
1 hour and 55 minutes. That means that the average breakfast takes 20 minutes or so?
I don't think so! This is not Denny's (where you would also find it hard to get in, waited
on, served, eat and pay in 20 minutes, without the distractions of Cinderella, Snow White
Peter Pan, Wendy, etc.)

Also, please think about this. WALT DISNEY WORLD does not need this little man to
fill a restaurant, or handle our cancellations. Believe me, we can do this perfectly
well ourselves. We do have the technology.

It was not that long ago that you could only book this (or any other) character
breakfast only 7 days in advance. There is no easy solution to this problem.

If you want to admit ir or not, the information on the Internet has made this simple
meal a vacation maker or breaker. I cannot tell you how many ladies have told me
that their 2 (or 3, or 4) year old dd will be broken hearted if they do not get to go to this
breakfast. My question is: "How did they know about it". Why get a small child
excited about doing something that is not already confirmed.

I digress.......This situation is NOT DISNEY'S FAULT, which seems to be a growing idea.
I have found over the years, that people will find a way to get what THEY want, no
matter how,or who it affects. No matter what Disney does about this situation, there are going to be people you will find a way around it, or complain that Disney is once again not
playing fair, or Disney is taking advantage, etc, etc, etc.

 

[DisneyKidds]

I believe they turn the tables over twice, meaning that each table is used as many as three times - once at 8, once at 9, and once at 10. Last PS many be around 10:00, but they serve later than that. In addition, we take our time at this breakfast (read between the lines - we don't let them rush us out as they would like to) and we are never there for more than an hour. I'm sure the average table spends 45 minutes there. Bottom line - Howies math probably adds up. 185 seats x 3 seatings = 555 available seats, give or take. Even at 475 seats a morning, if Howie fills 25 that is 5%. Whether this represents a little or a lot, or is good, bad or indifferent is a matter of opinion - but the math makes sense.

 

[disneyjunkie]

I'm sure they didn't really expect someone to take that challenge. We all know you can ask 3 different CMs the same question and get 3 different answers.

I spoke with 2 dining supervisors about the # of PSs for Cindy's that were booked in my name. They said they were calling because they wanted to make sure I was planning to use the PSs, if not they wanted me to cancel them so that they could give them to other families. I told them that I was not going to use ANY of them. I told them that I had booked them for other families that were having a hard time.

I asked them if they wanted me to cancel the PSs since I would not be the one using them, they said NO. I asked them if they could change the names they were booked under, they said NO. They said they want to be sure that someone would show up for the breakfast and that the tables would not be empty.

I'm sure they could put an end to this right away if they wanted to. They seem to be moving pretty slow on this issue, I wonder why?