Multi generation family living under one roof?

[kdonnel]

It works well for some. Your MIL is reluctant, so there is some concern. Can you all sit together and discuss the pros and cons? Everyone's concerns should be listened to. If you find you want to do this, then make sure there is a lot written down about the "what if's" - I would also get a lawyer involved who is familiar with elder law. What if one of them had a stroke and needed care? Do they both have long term care insurance policies? What would happen if you don't get along? If they pay for the fixing up of the basement, do they get all the say in how it will look? Who will deal with the contractor? It is your house, but they will be living in that area. Would their paying for the basement area cause issues with their estate and other in-laws? An elder law attorney will bring up all sorts of issues that no one would think about on their own, and would help you all come to an agreement which will protect all.

There will be an estate filled with 10's if not 100's of thousands of debt when they die. There is no long term care insurance. They will end up living with us at some point no matter what.

 

[mousefan73]

No way would I enter into a business transaction with family or be landlords for the inlaws.

This is where cultural differences lie.. For you this is a "business Transaction" for many cultures this is called "taking care of your own" and how family works.

 

[mom2rtk]

This is where cultural differences lie.. For you this is a "business Transaction" for many cultures this is called "taking care of your own" and how family works.

Except in the situation described in the OP, money seems to be a central priority in the arrangement.

 

[ronandannette]

This is where cultural differences lie.. For you this is a "business Transaction" for many cultures this is called "taking care of your own" and how family works.

I was thinking the same thing. I don't think the expectation has entirely gone by the wayside in our culture; there are plenty of threads here on the DIS about the conflict adult children feel about putting elderly parents in care facilities instead of moving them into one's own home. It's hardly the expected norm here though, like it is in most other parts of the world.

I do think there's a unique (and not necessarily always positive) sense of individualism in North American culture though that makes us all want to be as independent from one another as possible. And it's always eye-opening and a little disheartening to see just how many people do not have good, positive relationships with their aging parents/in-laws. I pray daily that my DS marries a merciful woman...my future may depend on it.

 

[wenrob]

This is where cultural differences lie.. For you this is a "business Transaction" for many cultures this is called "taking care of your own" and how family works.

The OP has pretty much described this as a business transaction. Entering a financial agreement with friends or family is almost always a bad idea.

As far as “taking care of your own” that can be done without moving someone into your home. For me it would destroy relationships. It’s not a bad thing to know your limits.

 

[Southernmiss]

As our parents age, I've often thought that I would like to have space for any of our 3 sets of parents to live next door to us.

Monetary arrangements never entered in my thoughts. Just the idea that they would be close enough for us to check on them, share a meal, help with appointments and errands.

We get along fine with all and all are still getting around fine.

I guess money would have to factor in, but would not be a primary reason for the arrangement.

 

[mousefan73]

I don't know where to start. I grew up in the US with German culture. I now live in Germany. I have seen where in the US multi-generational is usually based on elder care need or for financial reasons.. ( single moms who never move out). Rarely do you see homes specfically built or add-ons for multi-generational. Now here in Germany it is common. In fact many homes are built as 2 flats or more. My nephew just added on to his parents.. Is raising his family with his parents right there. In our town most 20 somethings still live at home in their own space. House are bigger so most have their own living/kitchen but still live technically under their parents roof. There are pros and cons. but IMO pros are bigger. In many cases it is a given kids take care of their parents in some way when they are older. popular is home assisted care that stops by 3 times a day.

Now in our case I moved into my DH's family home. but before I came both parents had died. If still alive I would be sharing a large house ( with own living space) with his mother.. Joke is DH says had she still been alive we would have never married LOL..

Years ago my mom moved closer to us when she retired. No way would it work that she lived under our roof. So she got her own place. I was younger and still getting my mid-life started. She though regulary spends the weekends with us and has her own room. One day when she cannot live alone she will move in with us, IF i am able to properly care for her, if not then a nursing home.

for me none of these decisions is for me a "business decision" If I wanted my mom to move in and there way an investment I would not start bean counting. that is me, it's my mom, she also helped me over the year financially and didnt bean count.

In your case I have the following comments based on my life:
1. I assume you are older, maybe mid 40s? at least for me I am also a bit more tamed down and having my mom around all the time is no big deal.. I am also older lol! having my mom around in the 20s/30s 24/7 would have been annoying... i did not want her knowing when we are coming and going. or what time getting home..
2. You say they are around all the time already, if you no issues here, then no worries
3. you are already thinking about elder care and this is a great step for when that day comes one day.
4. If it doesnt work out, you have a place to have your kids move into.. IMO I see no issue with adult kids living at home, if they are productive in their lives, pitch in.


5. Having own entrance is a must and that you have covered.

Believe me there is nothing nicer than have regular generational Sunday meals together. MY SIL does this all the time.. They switch who does the "hosting".. and it's like those big happy italien family meals.. Every weekend and often throughout the week.

 

[pixiedustedme]

They live just a few miles away as it is and have been an almost daily part of our lives. I am sure there might be some stress added if they live in the basement but I figure they will end up living with us at some point anyway.

My dad ended up living with us(and them some) for just over a year once he reached a point he could no longer live on his own. We did not have a separate living space for him and there was a good bit of friction created with the TV blaring at 110% at all times.

As for zoning allowing for a mother in law suite in the basement it is not an issue. It is not multi family but multi generational in a single family home. The basement would remain accessible from inside the home and would not be a totally separate apartment.

There are a lot of risks but there is the potential for big gains. Their budget would be greatly improved allowing them the flexibility to do more of what ever they might want to do while they still have a few years of good health left. It would add a tremendous amount of equity to our home and provide an income stream that would make paying for college trivial.

I guess my first step is to see if we can even get the basement finished for the price we need.

Sounds like you have a good idea of what you'd be getting into, so I say go for it if your mother-in-law agrees. Since you've done it before with your father, you know what it means to have others living with you, and you have a strong economic motive for yourselves and your in-laws.

 

[elaine amj]

I would do it. But then again, my MIL lived with me (no separation!) for 10 years and my mother now lives with us.

Yes, you sacrifice some privacy. And if there is some relationship friction, it can get tough. But u also save a lot of time in elder care (no need to make a special trip to help a parent with some mundane household chore or work a time into a schedule to visit). We have done weekly visits to my inlaws for over 15 years. Eats up a few hours of every Saturday. Worth it, but definitely a time commitment. We don't currently have a set schedule to visit my MIL in a nursing home so we have to constantly keep it in the back of our minds to work in a visit to her at least 1x a week. This has meant my teens see her very sporadically, sometimes as little as 1x a month.

My teens have loved spending more time with my mother (and so have DH and I). Of course there is a bit of friction. Now she lives here permanently she does have a bit of say in how the household runs - and my teens don't always like her higher cleaning standards haha. My mom's scatterbrain drives DH crazy. I just tell him she's just a more extreme version of me lol so he should have lots of experience. Good thing he likes her

Then again, it all depends on your family's relationships with your inlaws. Mine does work better when we give each other a bit more space.

 

[mjkacmom]

There will be an estate filled with 10's if not 100's of thousands of debt when they die. There is no long term care insurance. They will end up living with us at some point no matter what.

You don’t know that. Before he passed away, my dad was weeks away from entering a nursing home. He had about $800,000 when my mom died, plus a house worth $600,000 (which we are closing on next week), but his Alzheimer’s had progressed to a point that we could no longer care for him (he had a live in for years, but that ended up not working out). My friend built on apartment onto her house for her husband’s grandmother (grandma payed for it, no rent) and totally regretted it. After she died, she made sure her adult daughter moved in, because her mother wanted to.

 

[elaine amj]

One challenge with your scenario is that your inlaws would normally expect to pay $xx/mo in rent. At your place, they would have to pay for renovations plus rent, costing them quite a bit more in the short term.

 

[lifesavacation]

I can’t imagine spending my retirement years in a basement. Sounds miserable.

 

[AppleDumpling]

I can’t imagine spending my retirement years in a basement. Sounds miserable.

Not necessarily. I’ve seen some really beautiful finished basements. They are not all dark and damp dungeons. However, I would be concerned about accessibility issues with an older couple. They might be in good health now, but as they age, getting up and down the stairs will likely become increasingly difficult. A separate living space on the main floor makes more sense for elderly parents, IMO. Better to let your kids sleep in the basement.

OP, I don’t have personal experience with your situation but it sounds like your family has good relationships. You need to think it through and consider whether all of you can tolerate the day-to-day issues of living together in close quarters.

Of course, even in the closest of families, things often change and no one can predict what will happen in the future. I think you have to weigh the pros and cons, go with your gut, and hope for the best.

 

[apirateslifeforme]

Well, from the age of 2, I lived with my mother and grandparents. Now DH and I and our son live with my mother, in the same house. We don't have any separate living areas, we share the entire house (4 bedrooms). But my mom gives us our space; we remodeled and now there's another room with a TV where she watches her own programs in the evening. Instead of paying rent, we save our money and pay the taxes on the house (we live in CT - paying rent to my mom would probably be cheaper!). As far as food and utilities, whoever can pay at that time pays. Yeah, we butt heads a bit, but it works more than it doesn't.

 

[barkley]

There will be an estate filled with 10's if not 100's of thousands of debt when they die. There is no long term care insurance. They will end up living with us at some point no matter what

that's a pretty large range for anticipated debt. if it's b/c of no ltc insurance then getting an elder law attorney's advice could be even more valuable. i don't know how old your in-laws are but if they are older then having the agreement on the monies they expend for the basement documented in a certain manner could be vital if they find the need for medicaid. as has been discussed in another current thread the 'look back' period is comprehensive and absent doing the transaction in a certain way/documenting it appropriately it could create up to years of otherwise eligible coverage being unavailable.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

My mother lives in an in law apt attached to our home and it's worked out well for all of us. It hasn't been perfect, but it was easier that way than it was when she was living an hour away. She's been here 25 yrs. I think she's always benefitted from being here, but especially now, as she is ill, and has two personal caregivers here (myself and DD are nurses) and all of her needs taken care of. It is a family affair.

The one thing I will tell you is that when we built it, we had an architect design it as handicap accessible. For many years, that didn't matter - until the past year or so. Now, we're so thankful we did that. We had an OT and PT come in when Mom was in rehab and they said it's rare to see the set up we had for safety, and that lots of people have regrets when they can't go home because they're not safe there. So I'd say for a basement apartment that's something you need to really think about. 1) stairs, 2) dampness, 3) fire and CO, etc. Your city or town may have ordinances about having a stove, too, which you should check out if you have to do it illegally, for insurance coverage.

I think a lot of us are picturing a dank basement, but some basements can be really lovely. Ours is only half in the ground, with windows and natural light. It can still get a little damp, though. Every set up is different. Good luck with your decision. I live in a high COL area and this has become pretty common here. My in laws did it, too, and lots of friends and other family.

 

[Cubbiecakes]

I can’t imagine spending any time ever living with any of my family. Sounds miserable.

Fixed that for you.

I'd rather drive nails through my eyes than live with any of my relations.

 

[Hrhpd]

We would charge them half what it would cost them to rent a house or apartment and have them pay part of the basement finishing.

Some of the questions pulled from the afore mentioned thread where the MIL paid for the OP's house improvement and then the OP wanted to move. If I remember correctly, OP wasn't going to give MIL a dime back even though the MIL paid for the improvements and the house would sell for a substantial bit more. Plus the fact that the MIL invested part of her living retirement into the house with the guarantee that she would have a place to live. MIL was out her investment which was part of her retirement and had no place to live since her daughter was basically absconding with her money.

Do you have siblings that will receive part of an inheritance? Have you thought about how you are going to settle the estate when they have money invested in your house as their residence?

Do you have a repayment plan for the basement if they decide it does not work out and they want to move out?

What about if you decide to move? Since the finished basement will up the value of the house on top of the money that was put into finishing it, will you have a legal document to give them their investment money back and a percentage of the increased value of the house?

Will you have a backup plan of where they will live if you need to move?

If they are just gifting you the money to finish the basement so that they can live there, are you prepared to pay the gift taxes over $30,000 ($15,000 gift from each of your parents?)

 

[mom2rtk]

Wasn't there a thread a while back about one of these situations that went bad when the MIL paid for the house upgrades and the OP decided to sell and move on? I wish I could remember that thread. It's definitely a cautionary tale of how these things can go bad.

I found the thread I was thinking of:

https://www.disboards.com/threads/looking-for-advice.3629354/

 

[starry_solo]

I found the thread I was thinking of:

https://www.disboards.com/threads/looking-for-advice.3629354/

Gosh, was it almost 2 years ago for that thread....I thought it was only a few months ago