My theory on some of the SSR detractors.

[ricapito]

I felt this response to the "why do people bash SSR" type thread might be worthy of debate on its own. I don't believe the below is true across the board, it is just a hunch about some folks that may partly or wholly apply. I'm sure some will be offended, but that isn't intended, I just hope a few detractors will look honestly at their reasons for being so critical...

My thoughts:

I think there is more than meets the eye to some of the anti-SSR bandwagon, and it lurks and percolates in some posts, but no one discusses it outright it seems: blatant self-interest. Why? SSR changes DVC for everyone involved prior to its construction. In my understanding, DVC was smaller, less well-known, and more cult-like world before SSR. It was for those "in the know", and Disney set the initial bar extraordinarily high with theming and service. It appears it was a very collegial group, and their investment was protected by the small size and and a few other factors SSR impacted.

Then SSR comes along. It changes the dynamic as it makes DVC more mainstream, less "special" I think in some folks eyes, and this has created some negative feelings for some. It is likely a progression that started before SSR, but SSR brought it to the front page. SSR has commercialized DVC, soup to nuts--not just in the way the resort has been built (large, leveraging assets liked theme pools and restaurants and check-in areas etc across a bigger base of rooms), but even the accompanying advertising campaign to SSR has also taken DVC into the mainstream -- it's been huge and prominent. Then, after commercializing DVC, and arguably diluting some of the magic for some prior owners, there is the fact that it adds a lot of people who will want to try the other resorts -- and may even prefer them. This sense of entitlement to do just that by us new SSR owners seems to not sit well with some of the "I was here first" crowd that might be more guilty of bashing SSR.

Negativity and criticism are also a natural defense to a threat or to a inferiority complex: SSR provides 12 more years, and this threatens "DVC I" resale values down the road, maybe in 10 years or so (or less), when that time does indeed matter to new younger buyers. It will matter at some point, to be certain. It also may be that SSR creates a glut of DVC resales in general at some point, hurting earlier buyers investments. DVC I is yesterday, DVC II is tomorrow and today, and this might subtly bear on people as well and spur defenses. It may also get tougher to get reservations at the smaller resorts at the 7 month window, reducing the flexibility for the earlier members especially that they had come to expect.

This is not to say SSR is without fault, I am a convert from a prior detractor, but my criticisms were totally "pure" and unencumbered by the above. SSR is superior "on paper" for a variety of reasons -- so all that's left to equalize it is to attack its reputation and character.

BR

 

[Simba's Mom]

Your theory's interesting. I've noticed one other thing in the 3 1/2 years I've been smart enough to hang around here-any time there's a new resort, there are detractors. When BCV first opened, it seemed there were lots of visitors initially who were disappointed. I guess maybe we humans resist anything new, we prefer "the good ole days".

 

[bobbiwoz]

I do not consider myself a detractor of SSR. However, we bought just as BCV, BWV (the points from where the sales office was) and even VB from Disney were all nearly gone. We tried a resale at VWL, but it was ROFR'd. Instead of trying again, we went to Disney bought BWV and added on VWL. I say this because Tom from TTS once said that he didn't understand why people went to Disney right after ROFR. I know that we wanted one of those resorts, I also began receiving e-mails from people on the board who were "willing to sell" theirs. I didn't want to deal with that. I was just beginning to read the Disboards, and maybe yes, I could have waited and tried to come into the system via resale again, but with Magical Beginnings I did what I could to get what I wanted, and we are very happy.

We really do want to stay at either BWV, or VWL most of the time. And most of the time I find I can book before 7 months out. I would not be unhappy staying at SSR, we've tried it, we like it, (I booked exactly 7 months out for that night's stay, I really did want to be there) but we like what we have better.

SSR will be my choice over OKW because it has elevators in all buildings. I cannot easily walk down steps. OKW has the very reasonably priced GV and so, there's no decision without some regrets!

Bobbi

 

[T.E. Yeary]

Bobbi- you were getting E-Mails from board members that wanted to sell theirs??? Hmmmmmmm!!

 

[bobbiwoz]

Bobbi- you were getting E-Mails from board members that wanted to sell theirs??? Hmmmmmmm!!

To my hotmail account, not to the disboards personal messages.

Bobbi

PS. This was 2 years ago, nothing like that has happened again.

 

[DVCPAT]

My thoughts:

I think there is more than meets the eye to some of the anti-SSR bandwagon, and it lurks and percolates in some posts, but no one discusses it outright it seems: blatant self-interest. Why? SSR changes DVC for everyone involved prior to its construction. In my understanding, DVC was smaller, less well-known, and more cult-like world before SSR. It was for those "in the know", and Disney set the initial bar extraordinarily high with theming and service. It appears it was a very collegial group, and their investment was protected by the small size and and a few other factors SSR impacted.

Then SSR comes along. It changes the dynamic as it makes DVC more mainstream, less "special" I think in some folks eyes, and this has created some negative feelings for some. It is likely a progression that started before SSR, but SSR brought it to the front page. SSR has commercialized DVC, soup to nuts--not just in the way the resort has been built (large, leveraging assets liked theme pools and restaurants and check-in areas etc across a bigger base of rooms), but even the accompanying advertising campaign to SSR has also taken DVC into the mainstream -- it's been huge and prominent. Then, after commercializing DVC, and arguably diluting some of the magic for some prior owners, there is the fact that it adds a lot of people who will want to try the other resorts -- and may even prefer them. This sense of entitlement to do just that by us new SSR owners seems to not sit well with some of the "I was here first" crowd that might be more guilty of bashing SSR.

Negativity and criticism are also a natural defense to a threat or to a inferiority complex: SSR provides 12 more years, and this threatens "DVC I" resale values down the road, maybe in 10 years or so (or less), when that time does indeed matter to new younger buyers. It will matter at some point, to be certain. It also may be that SSR creates a glut of DVC resales in general at some point, hurting earlier buyers investments. DVC I is yesterday, DVC II is tomorrow and today, and this might subtly bear on people as well and spur defenses. It may also get tougher to get reservations at the smaller resorts at the 7 month window, reducing the flexibility for the earlier members especially that they had come to expect.

This is not to say SSR is without fault, I am a convert from a prior detractor, but my criticisms were totally "pure" and unencumbered by the above. SSR is superior "on paper" for a variety of reasons -- so all that's left to equalize it is to attack its reputation and character.

BR

I’ve always thought of DVC as great way to save money. We own at BWV and VWL and as long as I can get reservations 11 months out, I’m happy. Now that you mention it, I think SSR has made it very difficult to book HH in the summer months so I’ll have to start shopping for a small add-on contract in the near future.

I do look forward to new DVC resorts. A monorail line DVC would be really cool.

 

[TDC Nala]

I thought they just didn't like the outside corridors.

 

[drakethib]

SSR is a very beautiful place, however, there is something about it that both my wife and I just don't care for it.

However, many people don't like OKW and we love it.

So to each their own I guess.

 

[Beca]

I felt this response to the "why do people bash SSR" type thread might be worthy of debate on its own. I don't believe the below is true across the board, it is just a hunch about some folks that may partly or wholly apply. I'm sure some will be offended, but that isn't intended, I just hope a few detractors will look honestly at their reasons for being so critical...

My thoughts:

I think there is more than meets the eye to some of the anti-SSR bandwagon, and it lurks and percolates in some posts, but no one discusses it outright it seems: blatant self-interest. Why? SSR changes DVC for everyone involved prior to its construction. In my understanding, DVC was smaller, less well-known, and more cult-like world before SSR. It was for those "in the know", and Disney set the initial bar extraordinarily high with theming and service. It appears it was a very collegial group, and their investment was protected by the small size and and a few other factors SSR impacted.

Then SSR comes along. It changes the dynamic as it makes DVC more mainstream, less "special" I think in some folks eyes, and this has created some negative feelings for some. It is likely a progression that started before SSR, but SSR brought it to the front page. SSR has commercialized DVC, soup to nuts--not just in the way the resort has been built (large, leveraging assets liked theme pools and restaurants and check-in areas etc across a bigger base of rooms), but even the accompanying advertising campaign to SSR has also taken DVC into the mainstream -- it's been huge and prominent. Then, after commercializing DVC, and arguably diluting some of the magic for some prior owners, there is the fact that it adds a lot of people who will want to try the other resorts -- and may even prefer them. This sense of entitlement to do just that by us new SSR owners seems to not sit well with some of the "I was here first" crowd that might be more guilty of bashing SSR.

Negativity and criticism are also a natural defense to a threat or to a inferiority complex: SSR provides 12 more years, and this threatens "DVC I" resale values down the road, maybe in 10 years or so (or less), when that time does indeed matter to new younger buyers. It will matter at some point, to be certain. It also may be that SSR creates a glut of DVC resales in general at some point, hurting earlier buyers investments. DVC I is yesterday, DVC II is tomorrow and today, and this might subtly bear on people as well and spur defenses. It may also get tougher to get reservations at the smaller resorts at the 7 month window, reducing the flexibility for the earlier members especially that they had come to expect.

This is not to say SSR is without fault, I am a convert from a prior detractor, but my criticisms were totally "pure" and unencumbered by the above. SSR is superior "on paper" for a variety of reasons -- so all that's left to equalize it is to attack its reputation and character.

BR

You have some very interesting thoughts. But, I am just curious.....how would you classify people (like me) who bought at DVC I after SSR was available? I will admit to not being an SSR fan, but I was not a member during the old "status quo", so I am not resentful of things changing (although, I was a concerned when DVC announced SSR would grow to over 800 units...that's REALLY big!!). And, I am obviously not concerned about the longer contract length, as I chose to find resales, and struggle thru ROFR EIGHT times to get my desired number of points (thank goodness THAT is over) in spite of the shorter contract length. Honestly, the difference in length doesn't even cross my mind until someone mentions it...37 years seems like an awful long time to me!!!

As the owner of a smaller resort, I am concerned about difficulties getting into my resort at the 7 month window, but seriously....BCV is so popular, I wasn't able to get in there within the 7 month window right when SSR was having it's grand opening (I bought right around that time)...so, really while SSR's size might make a bit of difference, I knew when I bought BCV that it would be a resort that I would need to plan very far ahead to stay at.

My point is this...I don't have any "subversive" motives for not caring for SSR, and I don't have feelings of inferiority because of the shorter length of contract; I really could not be more thrilled with my purchase. That is why I spend so much time on these boards....somehow writing on here and conversing with others just makes me miss my second "home" a little less. I recently commissioned an artist to paint me a room divider similar to the one at BCV so I can re-decorate my guest room to look like BCV....I've spent a small fortune on this room. I can't wait to get to Texas so I can put it all together!! When I can figure out how to post pics on here, I will show you all the result of my efforts, I promise!!!

I honestly think it's just "different strokes for different folks". But, I think the reason you see more, "I don't like SSR" threads is two reasons:

1) People who are looking to buy SSR and are lucky enough to stumble across these boards often ask for opinions regarding this resort since that is what DVC is offering at the moment, and

2) People who have owned for awhile and post trip reports often mention their opinion of the resort upon their initial visit when they return home. Maybe some of this posting IS due to "Wow, I was really worried that I would regret not being able to purchase there...I'm so relieved that I don't care for the resort that I am going to tell you all about it." But, I think a lot of those postings are honest, sincere opinions. People love their home resorts with a fierce allegiance....SSR is different from any other resort....sometimes people are just glad to love where they own.

I don't know...maybe it is just me, or maybe I have missed some things since I have been off the boards for a few weeks...I just haven't seen people being really mean about SSR on these boards. Maybe someone could email me links that would show me where this bashing has taken place?


JMHO,



Beca

 

[jbwolffiv]

I thought they just didn't like the outside corridors.

 

[jimmytammy]

When we 1st purchased VWL, we hadnt been lucky enough to run across the DIS boards yet. 5 mos after the fact and 1 mos. after our 1st add-on we discover the DIS. Much to my dismay, I find many naysayers on here putting down VWL. We bought site unseen, so of course, Im thinking, what have I done?

Well, with the help of many DISers who were encouraging, and many VWL owners who had already made that first trip, my fears were laid to rest. And since that time, I have seen BCV owners go through it and current SSR owners are facing it. It seems that whatever resort is for sell or the newest addition, there is going to be certain backlash from a few.

We have stayed at SSR. And yes, I would stay again. Is it as nice as VWL? Well of course not But then again, Im supposed to be partial to my home resort, Arent I?

 

[DisFlan]

Our "bias" against SSR is a little different. We liked what was there before. We'd been staying there for years (since 1984) and loved it. When the old "Disney Village" units were demolished, we finally bought DVC - at BWV, not SSR. For us, building SSR was the equivalent of knocking down the Poly to put up a bunch of apartment type DVC units.

We didn't find SSR nearly as inviting or interesting as the old villas and townhouses it replaced. We're still hoping they'll save the Treehouses for future use.

DisFlan

 

[idratherbeinwdw]

I'm not sure what the thought behind this analysis is. I think it's simple--you either like a place or you don't. What's the difference why?

 

[Rozzie]

Ricapito-----I enjoyed your post and would have to say I agree to some extent on everything you said. I think SSR has changed DVC, I for one think it is for the good. Yet I have had people respond to SSR as we are "crazy" and that we are going to "destroy DVC". I think SSR will build the bank account and fuel the demand of future onsites--AKL or CR--maybe?? JMO!

Thanks for the post--- I think it is very thought provoking.

 

[bcvillastwo]

To the OP, you made some interesting points. I would need to think about them a bit before giving my opinion but I at the very least it should generate some interesting discussion.

We've been members since the spring of 2002. Since then we've stayed at HH, WLV, BWV, and BCV our home resort. To date we haven't seen VB but we have visited SSR and OKW. For us, it comes down to one thing we prefer BCV because we prefer the BCV atmoshphere because it's an easy walk to EPCOT, a pleasant boat ride to MGM, and the Boardwalk and its amenities are just a stroll away. That said, we still like the other resorts and at some point we intend to stay at each one--we just prefer BCV.

I suspect that many others feel similarly about their home resort for their own personal reasons.

I have no doubt that SSR will change things but in my mind it's simply too seen to know what the effects will be--good or bad. I have to believe that Disney and DVC management will be watching and monitoring the situation as it unfolds. If things go well for Disney and WDW then more DVC resorts are likely to follow. While no expert, it seems to me the DVC is a win, win for Disney and as long as it continues so, I see more DVC resorts in the future.

 

[gppnj]

When we 1st purchased VWL, we hadnt been lucky enough to run across the DIS boards yet. 5 mos after the fact and 1 mos. after our 1st add-on we discover the DIS. Much to my dismay, I find many naysayers on here putting down VWL. We bought site unseen, so of course, Im thinking, what have I done?

Well, with the help of many DISers who were encouraging, and many VWL owners who had already made that first trip, my fears were laid to rest. And since that time, I have seen BCV owners go through it and current SSR owners are facing it. It seems that whatever resort is for sell or the newest addition, there is going to be certain backlash from a few.

We have stayed at SSR. And yes, I would stay again. Is it as nice as VWL? Well of course not But then again, Im supposed to be partial to my home resort, Arent I?

Just out of curiosity, what were they saying about VWL? I could see where the theme wouldn't be to some peoples' taste, but other than that, there really isn't too much to complain about, I don't think.

 

[Granny]

Just out of curiosity, what were they saying about VWL? I could see where the theme wouldn't be to some peoples' taste, but other than that, there really isn't too much to complain about, I don't think.

Too small...too dark....too quiet...too remote....too woodsy....too boring.....too long for buses....etc, etc.

jimmytammy....glad you followed your heart!

ricapito...I don't think there is any one universal reason for someone not to care for SSR. I can think of a lot of reasons, though I am not a "detractor".

- Your comment that some people think that the sheer size and numbers involved with SSR will have an impact on the DVC they've come to know and love. I think there are some people who feel that way.
- Some people prefer a "hotel style" resort.
- Some people just prefer their home resort and ANYTHING else will compare poorly for them.
- Some people are into location...near MK, near EPCOT/MGM, etc.
- Some people are into larger rooms, and that's important to them.

By the way, I've watched VWL, BCV and now SSR open on these boards. And each was "bashed" by people who owned elsewhere. My gosh, you would have thought that BCV was a slum hotel to listen to some of the early reactions!

I think an equally interesting question is..."why do people feel so defensive when someone criticizes a resort?". I happen to really like VWL and BWV and bought there. If someone wants to criticize VWL's dark decor or BWV's long hallways, it really doesn't bother me a bit.

In fact, I find myself quite happy that many people prefer other resorts. What a mess this would be if every DVC owner preferred one resort!!

 

[jarestel]

People like different things, so it's not surprising that some members may not care for SSR. Or OKW, or VWL, or BWV, or BCV... I used to own 250 points at BCV, but we just didn't care for it, so the points went to someone via resale. Not that BCV was unpleasant, just that the things most people tout as benefits ( SAB, walking to Epcot, restaurants, etc ) weren't things we especially thought were all that meaningful to us. We prefer the other resorts, including SSR, over any of the Boardwalk resorts. Now that doesn't mean the Boardwalk area resorts aren't nice or people shouldn't stay there... it just means that, for us, we found it more in line with our tastes to be at OKW, SSR, or VWL.

And so the great resort debates will rage on, no matter where the newest DVC happens to be... Bring on the bashing of resorts, but I like what I like and no amount of arguing will change that!

 

[jimmytammy]

To answer your question...see Granny's reply just below your post. He answered with many reasons.

Its been so far in the past now that I cant remember which one of these issues it was that came to my worried attention. And now it doesnt matter.

The first time we pulled up to the front of WL and saw it in its majestic state, we knew we had not made a mistake. But all we had to go on were stays at the All Stars. And knowing that the All Stars were VERY nice for a value resort, we knew WL would be something special. But the written word here just about spoiled it for us. Good thing we had encouraging words to make us feel better about our purchase.

And I agree with you, there really isnt much to complain about VWL nor any of the other DVC resorts. We look forward to trying them all! After another stay at our favorite, VWL, we are giving BCV a try in Jan. And very much looking forward to it. No matter what the naysayers say

 

[SoCalKDG]

For people that owned DVC before SSR, SSR has brought many good things to the table. Its boosted the value of our points if someone needs to sell, its increased the population of DVC'rs to the point that we are getting additional benefits. If the next two additions to the DVC family are the Contemporary and at DLR, then everyone will have additional choices at the 7 month mark and the size of SSR will be long forgotten.