No the Magic isn’t gone but it’s at 25%

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I apologize I think I responding to you like a group when I should have addressed your comment directly.

No worries

That comes off as a personal wishlist kind of thing, if Universal could get 21 million a year at the gate, they would jump at the opportunity, no business turns away customers unless they can’t handle the demand, and I believe they could. It would be more congested, and wait times would definitely be up, but it would also mean they were a huge success

I think what I was trying to convey is wanting more profit, because hello any company wants that, but realistically realizing what your product can handle. Universal would love to get more of WDW's market share I'm sure of that but I don't think they want 21 million to flood IOA because of what that park has sure that's just my opinion of course.

I think they collectively across what will be now 3 theme parks plus their water park want millions and millions but even Disney is in their own eyes is struggling with crowding at their parks and they don't have the same levels as they did before. People complained so much about the crowding before. It's showing up on survey after survey how guests feel about the experience even now with Disney using their own manipulations.

HHN is also incredibly successful at Universal and they know it, they invest a lot in that and get a lot back too.

2020-2021 are hard to asses there were too many x-factors that companies couldn’t control, or had a hard time wrapping their arms around, pertaining to the pandemic to really get anything concrete out of them. This year should be a better indicator in my mind

Oh no I agree I very much was like these numbers are hard. I just was remembering that was mentioned, I only thought of that because you mentioned attendance.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Yeah but it hasn't appeared to grab a hold of the star wars people who didn't already go to Disney as much as it was thought to be.

I don't know if you were a lurker before joining the DIS but I remember a lot of the conversations when Star Wars was announced and over the years here when it was being built thinking this is it, this is going to be amazing and bring so many big star wars fans to Disney and it's going to be a new Disney y'all.

Yes sure it did but it opened with 1 ride and quickly got rid of some of its immersive features. I got to experience it out in CA in 2019 about 4 months after it had been opened and I heard from a lot of locals there they just were not impressed and this seemed to track at WDW. Rise is what really got people's attention although I didn't get to experience that ride until 2 1/2 years later at WDW). I really haven't heard of Star Wars people saying they'll go buy DHS just for Star Wars and that's all they are wanting to see, that was originally what many of us thought would be the case.

Star Wars is a great addition to Disney but I don't think it held as much wow factor as Universal's HP area did. The sheer amount of people who are willing to buy Universal tickets just for those two parts (and smart decision by Universal to use 2 parks for this.

I think Star Wars really appeals to a vast swath of the US demographic kind of like Disney, I would say that a large portion of the population likes Star Wars, but I believe the Star Wars hardos have always been overrated, they are talked about like Trekkies, but seem to pale in comparison. I think HP did so well numbers wise in comparison to GE because Universal got a huge attendance bump, Disney hasn’t had that with any of their add one outside of adding a new gate, and I think it’s because the demand for Disney is constantly and consistently maxed out, where Universal always has room for more.

I thought the consensus was this was def. not as successful as it was thought to be?

If that’s the case, I would again disagree with the boards, from everything I’ve read, it’s been doing great. I think people think that because the price is “outlandish” they’ve doomed it to fail, but when digging into it, it seems like it’s doing pretty dern good

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

If that’s the case, I would again disagree with the boards, from everything I’ve read, it’s been doing great. I think people think that because the price is “outlandish” they’ve doomed it to fail, but when digging into it, it seems like it’s doing pretty dern good

I think the price tag is what made people expect high. I think they've also reduced some of the immersive experience already. I think it's "not as successful" that I was speaking to, yes it's getting people to stay there but I'm not sure it's what was originally thought to be. That's going back to what people thought and expected Star Wars to do for Disney. Perhaps too high of expectation IDK.

Because of its price tag I'd expect some profit margin issues to not be felt as much. Still able to say it's very successful by Disney's standards and yet there is still a decent amount of availability at this point for a 2 night journey.

Here's the availability for the several months (not available for booking yet past end of this year)




It did have enough bookings during the summer, I think it was just the thought it would be completely booked up super fast. It's interesting they don't have the ability to book in 2023 yet.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

I think the price tag is what made people expect high. I think they've also reduced some of the immersive experience already. I think it's "not as successful" that I was speaking to, yes it's getting people to stay there but I'm not sure it's what was originally thought to be. That's going back to what people thought and expected Star Wars to do for Disney. Perhaps too high of expectation IDK.

Because of its price tag I'd expect some profit margin issues to not be felt as much. Still able to say it's very successful by Disney's standards and yet there is still a decent amount of availability at this point for a 2 night journey.

Here's the availability for the several months (not available for booking yet past end of this year)
View attachment 696616

View attachment 696617

It did have enough bookings during the summer, I think it was just the thought it would be completely booked up super fast. It's interesting they don't have the ability to book in 2023 yet.

Yeah, I think everyone projected them selling out the first year or so, I was never one of those people. Cruises typically don’t sell out, and I’d equate this more to a cruise then a standard hotel stay. That being said, this fall/ winter should be interesting, I think the school year this year is going to mean a lot to parents, who probably don’t want to pull kids from school after the last few roller coaster school years, I think Disneys third quarter won’t be as profitable bc of it, and I think that will also affect the Starcruiser. I think they are retooling the “program” which is probably why they haven’t released anything on 23’ yet

 

[lugnut33]

This is one thing that been poking at me for a while so figure why not throw it out there. Disney clearly Identified that they were selling themselves short at one point, and decided to capitalize on that. The market usually dictates how high a price increase they're able to stomach, the problem here is that the market has yet to push back as a whole. Sure the hardos on these boards may push back, but we are a pimple on the butt of Disney, it would take a lot more to throw them off their game. As a share holder, if there is money on the table Disney should be doing whatever they can to rake it in. On a personal note i would love for prices to come down, or go up high enough that the crowds start to taper off. I just can't back anyone who is upset with a company for doing everything within their power to make more money.

That doesn't negate how raising prices makes people feel. Everyone was complaining about gas prices increasing and yet oil and gas companies were making record profits. That didn't make anyone feel better about paying more.

 

[lugnut33]

What I’m saying is that if Disney adds more rides, they will raise the total capacity with it.
More rides means more people allowed through the gates

Right, don't add rides, add and entire park (see Universal).

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

That doesn't negate how raising prices makes people feel. Everyone was complaining about gas prices increasing and yet oil and gas companies were making record profits. That didn't make anyone feel better about paying more.

that is a bit different, Energy is a commodity which people really can't live without. Disney is a luxury, and if people don't like it then they don't have to go. The fact that Disney still has crazy demand proves that the point you have made above, and so many assert just isn't the case for the masses, and that people are pleased with the value Disney is offering

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Right, don't add rides, add and entire park (see Universal).

That would cause the exact same problem. Universal doesn't have the same demand Disney does so that's not apples to apples in this case. Adding a gate would just add to the problem in my opinion.

 

[Jrb1979]

That would cause the exact same problem. Universal doesn't have the same demand Disney does so that's not apples to apples in this case. Adding a gate would just add to the problem in my opinion.

Then the only answer is to start pricing people out. Start with Genie+ and make it $50 a day.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Then the only answer is to start pricing people out. Start with Genie+ and make it $50 a day.

They've literally been doing that for the last 2 decades, and it hasn't gotten there yet. People are willing to pay whatever Disney is asking, so we only have ourselves to blame. Market dictates price, and the market keeps telling Disney it can handle more

 

[Jrb1979]

They've literally been doing that for the last 2 decades, and it hasn't gotten there yet. People are willing to pay whatever Disney is asking, so we only have ourselves to blame. Market dictates price, and the market keeps telling Disney it can handle more

Agreed. IMO it's due to so many not willing to try other parks. The biggest reason I see is that the majority of Disney guests don't don't like thrill rides. Look at how many have motion sickness issues on Disney level rides.

 

[DCLMP]

They've literally been doing that for the last 2 decades, and it hasn't gotten there yet. People are willing to pay whatever Disney is asking, so we only have ourselves to blame. Market dictates price, and the market keeps telling Disney it can handle more

Attendance is down from 2019, but profits are up. Not everyone is willing to pay "whatever". It's the top earners that are willing to pay.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Agreed. IMO it's due to so many not willing to try other parks. The biggest reason I see is that the majority of Disney guests don't don't like thrill rides. Look at how many have motion sickness issues on Disney level rides.

IIRC we've been down this road before. Thrill does not equate to motion sickness. Motion sickness varies by person and by trigger. There are people who can do fast roller coasters with loops and steep drops but have issues with simulators and vice versa. Ones who get impacted by tight spaces, ones are fine with xyz.

Disney does appeal to a wider group of people but that in itself isn't related to motion sickness.

My husband can do Hulk, Time Traveler, and so many others but Remy got to him and he's no where near a person impacted by motion sickness like I am. Remy is not at all thrill. But then he's fine with every other simulator out there except Simpsons also got to him.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Attendance is down from 2019, but profits are up. Not everyone is willing to pay "whatever". It's the top earners that are willing to pay.

You can't really use this year as a measuring stick, it's still being reported that Disney is limiting crowds due to staff shortages, shipping delays ect. The pandemic still hasn't completely loosened its grip on the world yet. It's like saying Fords sales have not recovered from the pandemic, and saying at this point it's because they are offering a subpar product. unfortunately that is the easy out on this one where you can just dump on Disney when the reality is much more multifaceted

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Agreed. IMO it's due to so many not willing to try other parks. The biggest reason I see is that the majority of Disney guests don't don't like thrill rides. Look at how many have motion sickness issues on Disney level rides.

IMO Disney is an immersive experience especially when staying onsite, there is no one out there who can offer anything like it, (particularly speaking to WDW) so Disney maybe slowing innovation, but it's because everyone else is so far behind

 

[DCLMP]

You can't really use this year as a measuring stick, it's still being reported that Disney is limiting crowds due to staff shortages, shipping delays ect. The pandemic still hasn't completely loosened its grip on the world yet. It's like saying Fords sales have not recovered from the pandemic, and saying at this point it's because they are offering a subpar product. unfortunately that is the easy out on this one where you can just dump on Disney when the reality is much more multifaceted

Disney is most likely limiting capacity at the resorts to keep prices high. I don’t believe demand is that high at the current prices.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Disney is most likely limiting capacity at the resorts to keep prices high. I don’t believe demand is that high at the current prices.

You seem to be talking out of both sides of your mouth, it can't be that there isn't demand at the higher pricing, and Disney is limiting attendance to keep prices high.

 

[DCLMP]

You seem to be talking out of both sides of your mouth, it can't be that there isn't demand at the higher pricing, and Disney is limiting attendance to keep prices high.

You seem to have bad reading comprehension. I never said they were limiting attendance. I said they may be limiting hotel capacity. I have a hard time believing they are selling out hotel rooms at 700 plus a night. If they are then I guess everyone got rich the last two years. Considering the amount of debt people have, the percentage of people living pay check to paycheck, and the percentage of people behind on their electric bills I wonder.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

You seem to have bad reading comprehension. I never said they were limiting attendance. I said they may be limiting hotel capacity. I have a hard time believing they are selling out hotel rooms at 700 plus a night. If they are then I guess everyone got rich the last two years. Considering the amount of debt people have, the percentage of people living pay check to paycheck, and the percentage of people behind on their electric bills I wonder.

That still doesn’t make a lot of sense, Disney is limiting capacity and charging more at their hotels because they can’t sell the rooms? Why would they do that, just to save face? That doesn’t make a lot of business sense. They may be limiting capacity, but it isn’t because they want to charge more, I think you may be oversimplifying it. There are plenty of people across the country and the world who can still afford a Disney vacation, even at the higher prices

 

[DCLMP]

That still doesn’t make a lot of sense, Disney is limiting capacity and charging more at their hotels because they can’t sell the rooms? Why would they do that, just to save face? That doesn’t make a lot of business sense. They may be limiting capacity, but it isn’t because they want to charge more, I think you may be oversimplifying it. There are plenty of people across the country and the world who can still afford a Disney vacation, even at the higher prices

If they limit capacity they can keep prices high. Less supply=higher prices. It's the same reason airlines cut flights when operating costs are high. Less flights and higher fares. I agree there are plenty of people that can afford a Disney vacation, but it used to be a place where even the middle class could afford to take their families. A year from know the Deep discounts will be back so it's a mute point anyway. The economy is about to implode.