Noom?

[Park Pirate]

So, your example ignores stored energy already in the body. Technically, I can eat nothing for a day and my body will still "find" the calories it needs. This can go on for several days, as you probably know. Fat and muscle will br broken down for energy in the absence of "enough" calories from food. That's how weight loss happens, after all.

The other thing you are doing is thinking about calorie burn as a math equation when it's more like a budget. The body doesn't burn an equal number of calories per hour over a 24 hour period. Quite the opposite. If someone runs or walks 5 miles, the body provides that energy at that time. LATER, when you are resting, your body shifts and now instead of burning 80 cal/hour, it knocks that down to 50 cal/hour. Your body will adapt and use more energy when more energy is required and less energy for both essential and non essential processes when you are at rest. This is why "calories in/calories out" does NOT work.

If one wants to lose weight, what needs to happen is you need to feed your body just SLIGHTLY less than it needs to maintain its weight, but not so little that stress hormones get activated to hang onto your fat stores out of fear of starvation. You want your body tapping into your fat stores just a little bit every day. It's a delicate balance.

But that is exactly what I am saying. I am not ignoring stored energy. With exercise increasing the amount of energy required, the body either requires more food (allowing you to eat more and maintain weight) or it has to use stored energy if you eat the same, resulting in weight loss. I think this is exactly what I said. Regardless, exercise must be accounted for.

A balanced budget is a math equation. I am talking about an average daily intake vs expenditure. I clearly said that your body will adjust somewhat, for example when at rest. However, your body can only adjust so much and my example stands. A 400+ increased energy need will not be easily and completely compensated for by your body- thus either extra food is allowed to cover the balance or, like you said, stored energy is needed.

I am not saying that Calories in vs out is the only thing to consider, but to say that exercise does not allow a body to eat more and maintain weight is just not right either.

 

[DLgal]

I am not saying that Calories in vs out is the only thing to consider, but to say that exercise does not allow a body to eat more and maintain weight is just not right either.

I am talking in the context of weight loss. Exercise is exactly how you maintain a weight loss once you've achieved it, while allowing your body to eat more. But in the process of weight loss, if your app gives you a 1500 calorie food budget and you are an average person who burns an average of 2000 calories per day, running 5 miles does NOT mean you can eat an extra 500 calories on top of your 1500 calorie diet and lose weight. You simply won't lose weight that way. You will maintain your weight, because your body isn't going to burn 2500 calories, it's still going to burn just about 2000. THAT is what I am trying to say. You don't just get to add your workout to the 2000 calories your body burns that day, because a certain amount of activity is ALREADY baked into the equation. A very easy way to lose weight is to simply eat your BMR calories and do NOTHING else. And when you are cutting calories for weight loss, unless you are running a marathon, don't eat back your calories. It's counterproductive.

In the context of a budget, what happens when you allocate a certain amount of dollars to groceries and then you go over? You pull the money from another category to make up for the overage, leaving less in the other category. Same thing. You don't suddenly have more money come out of nowhere.

 

[Park Pirate]

I am talking in the context of weight loss. Exercise is exactly how you maintain a weight loss once you've achieved it, while allowing your body to eat more. But in the process of weight loss, if your app gives you a 1500 calorie food budget and you are an average person who burns an average of 2000 calories per day, running 5 miles does NOT mean you can eat an extra 500 calories on top of your 1500 calorie diet and lose weight. You simply won't lose weight that way. You will maintain your weight, because your body isn't going to burn 2500 calories, it's still going to burn just about 2000. THAT is what I am trying to say. You don't just get to add your workout to the 2000 calories your body burns that day, because a certain amount of activity is ALREADY baked into the equation. A very easy way to lose weight is to simply eat your BMR calories and do NOTHING else. And when you are cutting calories for weight loss, unless you are running a marathon, don't eat back your calories. It's counterproductive.

In the context of a budget, what happens when you allocate a certain amount of dollars to groceries and then you go over? You pull the money from another category to make up for the overage, leaving less in the other category. Same thing. You don't suddenly have more money come out of nowhere.

I guess we are going in circles. I agreed with you that the apps are deceptive. But the notion I had issue with was that you implied that exercise doesn’t allow you to eat more. If the number of calories you burn exercising exceeds what your body can adjust to, then you can either eat more and stay the same, eat the same and lose weight (from using stored energy) or something in between which could allow you to eat slightly more and lose less weight, but still lose. Obviously, hormones and other factors play a part.
I am not sure what the point of your grocery example is. It is what we have been saying all along. If your body needs more energy (or money for groceries), it has to come from somewhere else (more food intake or stored energy).

 

[threeboysmom]

I had success with Noom. Just reached my goal weight this week actually (yay me!).

Can you do most everything Noom offers for free elsewhere? Absolutely! Tons of books and articles to read about weight loss, food tracking apps galore, weight trackers, support groups, etc. BUT I chose to pay $45/month for it because I don’t like wasting money. I knew if I paid for it, that would hold me accountable. And it worked like a charm! I logged every meal (never missed), weighed every day, and never went over my calories.

Key is to find what works for YOU.

 

[Christine]

I think @DLgal and @Park Pirate are essentially agreeing with each other! LOL! I am a big advocate of Calories In/Calories Out or CICO. It has solidly worked for me. The name of that method could be a little confusing because a calorie in is not exactly equal to a calorie out. I think these days, with all the fitness apps/calorie burn trackers people get really on the wrong path because I don't believe (at least in my case) the the calorie burn that is reported is realistic so I just don't pay attention to it, but many do.

For my own situation, exercise has definitely made a difference in the amount I can eat. Not huge like you'd think, but something. In 2019/2020, I set out to lose 15 pounds. I have always used the MyFitnessPal app and previously SparkPeople to track my eating. I do this because I am HORRIBLE at eyeballing the right portions. As a woman in my late 50s, I don't get the calorie allowance I used to get. When I started all this, I had a severe foot injury that prevented me from doing any sort of impactful, calorie expending exercise so I set my lifestyle to the worst (sedentary) and with my age and current weight, gave me something like 1470 calories to lose 1/2 pound (or less) a week. I knew I couldn't live on that happily but I got close to it and managed to lose the weight over several months with zero exercise.

I then had surgery in 2021 and spent 8 months recuperating (and eating) and gained back my weight because I was not watching my food intake, I was non-weight bearing for a long time, and food was my only source of entertainment. This past December I was finally able to be meaningfully active so I went to the gym and scaled my food intake back to around 1600 calories. I spent about 1 hour in the gym at least 3 times a week doing cardio for about 40 minutes (rowing and elliptical--can't do anything with impact) and then resistance for the time I have left. My estimated calorie burns are around 600 or so. I don't believe they are that high and I would never "eat them back" as many people do. I think I might actually burn 100 calories (again, not sure).

I will say that this time, with the exercise added, I am able to eat a little bit more than I was able to as a sedentary person in 2019/2020, and the weight is rolling off pretty well--noticeably more so than it did without thet exercise. If I ate back my 400-ish calories a day, I know it would stall because many years ago, I bought into that and believed those burn rates.

I realize everyone's body is different, but for me, the amount I consume (IN) plus the amount I move (OUT), is clearly working for me.

I've tried a few other things like the "Only Eat Whole Foods and it Doesn't Matter" plan (didn't work--I can eat a LOT of healthy foods and still eat too many calories and gain weight). Intermittent fasting: I can see how that works if you can control your portions but it caused me to overeat way too much during my eating cycle. I did it for several months and there were no hormone changes that affected my eating desires or caused me to shed pounds.

 

[Alicefan]

I'm having luck by cutting out processed food. I have tried every fad to come down the pike but the only thing that ever really works is portion control. I find that by eating REAL food, I can have a bit more of it and it keeps me fuller longer. I've lost 13lbs in 6 weeks. A typical day looks like this:

Morning: Plain Greek yogurt sweetened with honey or stevia with a tablespoon of granola or musli.

Lunch: half cup of brown rice with 2oz of rotisserie chicken on top and a cup of roasted veggies.

Dinner: either same as lunch or spiraled zucchini and other veg with a homemade marinara sauce a teaspoon of pesto and a tad of parmesan cheese and maybe a half an air fried burger patty that I cut up for some protein on top.

Sometimes just a nice salad with the rotisserie chicken and that simply 60 ranch dressing. Being careful to only use the actual serving size and just really stirring the salad around to coat the leaves. Takes some getting used to, not drowning my salads in dressing, but once you do, you get kinda grossed out by a lot of dressing after a while.

 

[kymom99]

I tried noon but as others said, found it too cutsie. I also thought it contradicted itself at times. And the coach messages were canned. I couldn’t use it. I had great success with old WW. The plan that used calories, fat and fiber. It’s far from that now.

 

[threeboysmom]

I'm having luck by cutting out processed food. I have tried every fad to come down the pike but the only thing that ever really works is portion control. I find that by eating REAL food, I can have a bit more of it and it keeps me fuller longer. I've lost 13lbs in 6 weeks. A typical day looks like this:

Morning: Plain Greek yogurt sweetened with honey or stevia with a tablespoon of granola or musli.

Lunch: half cup of brown rice with 2oz of rotisserie chicken on top and a cup of roasted veggies.

Dinner: either same as lunch or spiraled zucchini and other veg with a homemade marinara sauce a teaspoon of pesto and a tad of parmesan cheese and maybe a half an air fried burger patty that I cut up for some protein on top.

Sometimes just a nice salad with the rotisserie chicken and that simply 60 ranch dressing. Being careful to only use the actual serving size and just really stirring the salad around to coat the leaves. Takes some getting used to, not drowning my salads in dressing, but once you do, you get kinda grossed out by a lot of dressing after a while.

How many daily calories do you consume? That menu seems really low to me. Are you hungry during the day?

 

[Where’s the beef]

Noom is overall an eating disorder training course marketed as a thoughtful diet. I’d encourage anyone considering it to read this.

 

[DLgal]

How many daily calories do you consume? That menu seems really low to me. Are you hungry during the day?

It does seem way too low. I would guesstimate that is only around 1000 calories, unless breakfast is like 3 cups of greek yogurt.

 

[emmybee]

I lost 20 lbs last year w/ Noom, and I am still at my goal weight. I am not a disciplined person, and I needed something to be accountable to....at least initially.

It comes down to a choice to commit, so without it, I don't see it working. The lessons are cheesy, but do impart some useful information. You have to keep track of your calories, water intake, and activity. It's all part of retraining yourself into healthy habits. It's not so much about denying yourself, but about making better choices. So I didn't avoid all sweets & carbs, and never felt like I was starving myself.

I did the free trial period, and then signed up for one round. I didn't need to finish that round because by that point, I felt that I had internalized things well enough.

I will say that I wasn't one who ever weighed myself, or even owned a scale. That changed w/ Noom. I weigh myself pretty regularly to make sure I stay on track. Since the holidays, I sometimes stray about 3 lbs, but then bring myself back. I don't want to allow myself to regain the weight, and the scale is my form of staying accountable.

There are free versions that lack the lessons, but it's all about what you need to reach your goal.

 

[Alicefan]

How many daily calories do you consume? That menu seems really low to me. Are you hungry during the day?

It depends on my portions really. I would say around 1200 or under for me. Believe me, anything over that and I gain. Not actually hungry but of course I want junk food occasionally. I find that the yogurt with so much protein is more filling than you'd think, and all of the veggies. The only thing that is really on the low side is the meat which is about 3oz a day. The rest is all recommended serving sizes, which seems like nothing in today's world.

 

[Alicefan]

It does seem way too low. I would guesstimate that is only around 1000 calories, unless breakfast is like 3 cups of greek yogurt.

Yeah, it is on the lower side, but when you add in my coffee with cream and the occasional grapefruit, it's all up there in calories. It doesn't take much for it to add up. Once you drizzle the veggies with olive oil, add the granola and musli to the yogurt. Those two things are really high calorie foods coming in around 130 for just a third cup. I eat about a cup of yogurt and it's 150 I believe for 2/3. Trust me, it's really easy to go above my calories for the day. I don't have a metabolism for crap!

 

[Karin1984]

Tried it an almost immediately removed it from my phone again. I found the app inconvenient, and it is doesn't work properly outside the US. I am not in the US.

When doing weightwatchers or using the free My Fitness Pal app, I really liked using the bar code scanner to log my food and I like seeing my macro's, not just calories. So that plus an annoying app made me cancel Noom again.

For the mental health part in combination with food, I found it more useful to work one to one with a specialist on this.

 

[Mokat76]

I do Noom and like it pretty well. I’m pretty successful when I work the program. It’s not a quick fix fad. The readings have helped me assess and alter (or at least understand) some habits and behaviors. Is it perfect? No. Is any commercial product perfect? No. I’m not always a fan of the cutesy writing style, but I don’t let momentary annoyance detract from overall progress. I was a WW subscriber for quite some time. I prefer Noom. At the end of the day, each of us needs to find what works for ourselves.

 

[threeboysmom]

Yeah, it is on the lower side, but when you add in my coffee with cream and the occasional grapefruit, it's all up there in calories. It doesn't take much for it to add up. Once you drizzle the veggies with olive oil, add the granola and musli to the yogurt. Those two things are really high calorie foods coming in around 130 for just a third cup. I eat about a cup of yogurt and it's 150 I believe for 2/3. Trust me, it's really easy to go above my calories for the day. I don't have a metabolism for crap!

I certainly hear you on the crap metabolism. I think I've ruined mine for life with all the yo-yo dieting I've done over the years.