Thoughts on Disney/ Florida Legal Battle News

Status
Not open for further replies.
As I wrote previously, I don't think that a settlement is possible unless the Florida state legislature and DeSantis agree to undo some of the new laws. That's not likely.
Under the current climate, probably correct. But the Government will change, probably before the courts resolve this dispute. At that time you may see a quiet settlement under which each party agrees to drop their suit in return for some unspecified considerations.
 
I very much appreciated Jack's wealth of knowledge, but I was pretty lost in all the legalese. It's needs to be REALLY dumbed down for people like myself to understand. :D
If you have questions, I'll be happy to try to answer them. I drowned on too long and just had to assume listeners would know some of the background. But in case it helps, here goes.

There are two (possibly three) agreements at issue. One is a "restrictive covenant" which RCID and WDW agreed upon. A restrictive covenant is simply a contract, typically involving land use, where landowners agree to refrain from certain conduct. Ordinances accomplish much the same thing only ordinances are laws passed by municipalities while restrictive covenants are agreements between two or more parties. Restrictive covenants are typically imposed when property is purchased. The town of "Celebration" is good example (its online restrictive covenants are 128 pages).

WDW transferred a decent amount of developed real property to RCID (or RCID developed property WDW transferred to it). From looking at the Orange and Osceola online tax maps, RCID owns most of the main roads, most of the power facilities (other than the solar power panels), solid waste and recycling facilities (not sure about recycling as Disney may on it) and, of course, the fire stations. What surprised me, assuming the tax maps are accurate, is that RCID owns at least one or more facility in or near each of the theme parks. There's a large facility north of the MK, two facilities in Epcot (you see two facilities (an electrical substation and chillers) from the outside part of Test Track), one or two in DHS (north of Slinky Dog) and a larger waste facility on the western part of the property in Osceola County. In AK, RCID owns the canal near Rafiki's Planet Watch. Here's the Orange County assessor's map:https://vgispublic.ocpafl.org/webmapjs/# (click on identify and then select property to see who owns or is responsible for paying taxes on the property).

To over simplify it, the restrictive covenant had RCID agree that its property would only be used for the "public and governmental purposes that such RCID Property is or are being used as of the Effective Date." While RCID's property is small, and largely out of sight of guests, I can see Disney wanting to prevent the Governor or CFTOD from using the RCID property to build a prison, just for argument sake. The restrictive covenant includes a list of "prohibited uses" which covers any advertising or publicity about any business other than RCID. The restrictive covenant also prohibited RCID from using the "Disney" name, "Walt Disney World" or any Disney characters.

The restrictive covenant, by the way, is the one that made all the news for having the "King Charles clause."

As an aside, if Disney wanted to make life really interesting, it could. For example, while RCID owns the chillers and substation north of the MK, Disney apparently owns the parking lot and we all know how Disney likes to charge for parking. I suspect Disney's real concern are the roads. The tax maps are not detailed enough to know for sure but with RCID owning the main roads (including World Drive, East Buena Vista Drive, Epcot Resorts Blvd, Epcot Center Dr ), the land between the roads, and probably some part of the land on either side, I can see Disney wanting to prevent CFTOD from putting anything (billboards, etc) along the road.
 
Under the current climate, probably correct. But the Government will change, probably before the courts resolve this dispute. At that time you may see a quiet settlement under which each party agrees to drop their suit in return for some unspecified considerations.
I don't think so. DeSantis is going to be in power for another 3.5 years. The case will almost surely be resolved by then. Even if it isn't, there's no guarantee that the next governor would be better for Disney. And anyway, they would still have to convince the legislature to repeal some of those new laws. Otherwise, Disney would find themselves in a position where every election might bring along a governor that appoints unqualified people to the CFTOD board.

You can't repeal a law in a settlement agreement. There's just no way to settle this one.
 


You can't repeal a law in a settlement agreement. There's just no way to settle this one.
Repealing or amending the law would be one of the provisions of the settlement agreement.
 
The legislature is not party to any settlements. DeSantis can't make them pass a new law.
Why couldn't they be convinced to modify the law? They seem to be taking their direction in passing the laws right now. It would just take them agreeing that it's a better solution. The settlement would just have to give them something they can point to as a "win" so they can save face.
 


Why couldn't they be convinced to modify the law? They seem to be taking their direction in passing the laws right now. It would just take them agreeing that it's a better solution. The settlement would just have to give them something they can point to as a "win" so they can save face.
Disney would have to be pretty stupid to accept any settlement before the laws are changed. And the legislature and DeSantis would have to trust Disney enough to change the laws before Disney agrees to the settlement. I can't see either of those things happening.
 
Disney would have to be pretty stupid to accept any settlement before the laws are changed. And the legislature and DeSantis would have to trust Disney enough to change the laws before Disney agrees to the settlement. I can't see either of those things happening.
It's actually simple. The settlement is contingent on the law being changed.
 
It's actually simple. The settlement is contingent on the law being changed.
Then you'd just end up back in court if the law didn't change, but now it would be even more complicated because Disney would still want its original Prayer and it would also want something extra for DeSantis et. al. going back on the settlement agreement. That sounds bad to me.

Besides, Disney is trying to go all the way back to RCID before Senate Bill 4C was passed. That's probably the only safe solution for Disney. Anything less is going to have the new board constantly trying to cause trouble and the governor and legislature trying to find new ways to mess with the district and Disney (e.g. the new bill concerning transportation systems).
 
Then you'd just end up back in court if the law didn't change, but now it would be even more complicated because Disney would still want its original Prayer and it would also want something extra for DeSantis et. al. going back on the settlement agreement. That sounds bad to me.
The point is that each party will see a benefit in the settlement. With a "Win" the government will save face and promote the tourism industry in the state.
 
Besides, Disney is trying to go all the way back to RCID before Senate Bill 4C was passed. That's probably the only safe solution for Disney.
Surely there is some compromise solution. Perhaps a split board?
 
Surely there is some compromise solution. Perhaps a split board?
If the motivation were only simply around dissolving a special district to "right the wrongs" of self-dealing and advantageous privileges - I would say a compromise could be attained.

Despite the veneer of the state's justifications, the reality is their motivation has little to do with resolving a special district run amok. So now, Disney has to defend and for as much as they can get, perhaps settling on less based on court guidance/rulings.

The instigators only need to drag this on for as long as possible to generate the headlines necessary to campaign and fundraise - compromising / settling serves no purpose to this motivation - unless voter support dramatically shifts to the negative - then perhaps a settlement becomes an escape hatch. Not really seeing this currently other than a few comments being thrown around - but no serious resistance to it now
 
Last edited:
The point is that each party will see a benefit in the settlement. With a "Win" the government will save face and promote the tourism industry in the state.
What does Disney get out of settling that they couldn't get from a trial? Disney's case seems pretty strong. I think they'd do better before a judge than they would settling. And, again, the legislature isn't party to the case, which means that any settlement is already shaky and complicated. So, what's Disney's incentive here?
Surely there is some compromise solution. Perhaps a split board?
Why should they? How does this help Disney or RCID? Why must everything end in compromise when one side is very clearly in the wrong?
 
What does Disney get out of settling that they couldn't get from a trial? Disney's case seems pretty strong.
The results of a trial are not a certainty. They could loose. They could win. A settlement would give them whatever they think is most important and they could give up what they think is not significant.

The two parties both need to save face in this battle. Doing it through a settlement is better all around.
Why should they? How does this help Disney or RCID? Why must everything end in compromise when one side is very clearly in the wrong?
We aren't sure that one side is clearly in the wrong. That's up to the court to decide. There may be enough uncertainty about how the courts would rule on both sides of the issue which is where the settlement discussions would bear fruit.
 
The results of a trial are not a certainty. They could loose. They could win. A settlement would give them whatever they think is most important and they could give up what they think is not significant.

The two parties both need to save face in this battle. Doing it through a settlement is better all around.

We aren't sure that one side is clearly in the wrong. That's up to the court to decide. There may be enough uncertainty about how the courts would rule on both sides of the issue which is where the settlement discussions would bear fruit.
I just don't see it. The only safe way out of this is for RCID to be reconstituted as it was. As long as the Governor of Florida has a say on who runs the district, Disney will always have to worry about DeSantis or the Next DeSantis messing with their stuff again. If I were Disney, I'd rather a board that I controlled or no district at all instead of having to deal with unpredictable governors.

And while you're right that only the courts can decide whether one side is "wrong", every legal analysis that I've seen so far says that Disney has a very strong case and that they're likely to prevail in court. I'd imagine that Disney agrees. So, unless the settlement is basically "we'll repeal all of the laws and reestablish RCID with a board that Disney controls, but the Governor (or someone) gets to appoint a powerless minority to the board", then I can't see Disney agreeing.
 
If I were Disney, I'd rather a board that I controlled or no district at all instead of having to deal with unpredictable governors.
In the spirit of compromise, how about a 5-person board where two are appointed by the State, two are selected by the landowners, and one is jointly selected by Orange & Osceola counties? And they would serve staggered 3-year terms.
 
In the spirit of compromise, how about a 5-person board where two are appointed by the State, two are selected by the landowners, and one is jointly selected by Orange & Osceola counties? And they would serve staggered 3-year terms.
That puts Disney in a minority position. I wouldn't accept it if I were them.

I don't see a point in us negotiating, though. We're not parties to the lawsuit.
 
From my perspective, the olive branch was earlier this year when the RCID was abolished but essentially recreated with the same powers, the only difference being that the government would appoint the board rather than Disney. It seemed to me and many others that this was basically a way to allow both sides to save face. The government got their win, the RCID is abolished. But Disney got to keep their district.
The board was put under control of the governor. The same governor who will be in office for 4 more years and has taken over RCID despite none of his concerns being under RCID control. The motivation was clearly retribution and not exploring all options to protect your business in that scenario would be a failure of Disney to protect their shareholders.

IMO, what occurred with the creation of the CFTOD was actually worst case scenario for Disney. At least if RCID was abolished Disney have had their bonds dissolved... and I'm guessing the boards of Orange/Osceola counties are more friendly than the CFTOD board the governor selected.
 
The board was put under control of the governor. The same governor who will be in office for 4 more years and has taken over RCID despite none of his concerns being under RCID control. The motivation was clearly retribution and not exploring all options to protect your business in that scenario would be a failure of Disney to protect their shareholders.

IMO, what occurred with the creation of the CFTOD was actually worst case scenario for Disney. At least if RCID was abolished Disney have had their bonds dissolved... and I'm guessing the boards of Orange/Osceola counties are more friendly than the CFTOD board the governor selected.

Yes but the RCID was basically a phoenix reborn as the CFTOD, still a rubber stamp for Disney as long as they bent the knee. DeSantis wasn't going to bite the hand that feeds - he needed a win for his base, but Disney did too - that's why Chapek made that fateful decision/announcement to begin with that sent all this spinning.

Disney was fooling themselves if they ever thought for one second that their bonds would be dissolved or folded into the counties. That was never an option.

Disney was the one that stepped in the gum on the floor to start all this.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

GET A DISNEY VACATION QUOTE

Dreams Unlimited Travel is committed to providing you with the very best vacation planning experience possible. Our Vacation Planners are experts and will share their honest advice to help you have a magical vacation.

Let us help you with your next Disney Vacation!












facebook twitter
Top