What Roy Disney's granddaughter has to say about Iger

[Coach Holden]

Sounds like we need Gordon Gecko to give another Teldar Paper speech regarding the over-compensation of executive and vice-presidents

 

[PasadenaJacket]

No, I did not say he should be paid the same salary as his lowest paid employee. I said he is only worth as much. If his employees all stop doing their jobs, he won't be worth squat (and your shares will rocket to the bottom too) to the Disney company. Of course he should be compensated for his education and his experience and knowledge.

False. He should be paid the lowest amount that he is willing to work, which is where he is now. The board has a duty to shareholders to find the best CEO; if they could have found a better CEO that would work for less, then they would have done so. Which is what we all do, right? When we hire handymen, or other workers? Negotiate for the best value at the lowest price? It turns out that he is an excellent CEO, and he would be extremely difficult to replace. There are currently only a handful of truly great CEOs who can generate billions of dollars of wealth for their shareholders. Bezos, Musk, Iger, Nadella, Buffet, Zhang, not a lot more than that.

Those alone would make his pay quite a bit more than most of his employees. But the fact remains he would not be successful with this company or any company if not for the people below him.

Also false. If they stopped working, the workers would be replaced, right? And they are adequately payed right? If they could do better, they would have walked by now. No one is holding a gun to their heads.

 

[luvsJack]

False. He should be paid the lowest amount that he is willing to work, which is where he is now. The board has a duty to shareholders to find the best CEO; if they could have found a better CEO that would work for less, then they would have done so. Which is what we all do, right? When we hire handymen, or other workers? Negotiate for the best value at the lowest price? It turns out that he is an excellent CEO, and he would be extremely difficult to replace. There are currently only a handful of truly great CEOs who can generate billions of dollars of wealth for their shareholders. Bezos, Musk, Iger, Nadella, Buffet, Zhang, not a lot more than that.



Also false. If they stopped working, the workers would be replaced, right? And they are adequately payed right? If they could do better, they would have walked by now. No one is holding a gun to their heads.

No they are not adequately paid. Not at all. They are paid below the poverty level for a family of four. (going by the amount listed by a pp). How do you assume that is "adequate"? IF they could do better? Wow. A bit elitist are we?

If they quit, who will serve you on your vacations? Clean after you? Entertain you? Attitudes like that are the number one problem. Guess what? You aren't better than them.

Everyone that does a job and does it well, deserves to be paid a living wage. What they make is NOT a living wage. Especially in the high col areas they live in.

 

[PasadenaJacket]

No they are not adequately paid. Not at all. They are paid below the poverty level for a family of four. (going by the amount listed by a pp).

A very large percentage of CMs are young, single, and glad to have the experience working at Disney. If they thought they were underpaid, they have other options, but they choose to stay, which means they agree to their salary. If they weren't happy, they would do what all of us do when we can do better: we enter the job market.

How do you assume that is "adequate"? IF they could do better? Wow. A bit elitist are we?

The CMs are saying it's adequate, right? By not leaving?

If they quit, who will serve you on your vacations? Clean after you? Entertain you? Attitudes like that are the number one problem. Guess what? You aren't better than them.

I never said I was better than anyone.

Everyone that does a job and does it well, deserves to be paid a living wage.

Interesting. So people that don't do their job well don't deserve your "living wage"?

What they make is NOT a living wage. Especially in the high col areas they live in.

Socialism was discredited a lot of years ago. Paying someone more than their services are worth doesn't make sense. Do you pay your hair cutter more if she has a baby? I know you think you can force those greedy executives to support those poor souls who somehow unlucked themselves into four kids on a CM salary, but the making the salary higher would only really hit Disney investors, the majority of which are elderly retirees on fixed income.

 

[luvsJack]

A very large percentage of CMs are young, single, and glad to have the experience working at Disney. If they thought they were underpaid, they have other options, but they choose to stay, which means they agree to their salary. If they weren't happy, they would do what all of us do when we can do better: we enter the job market.


The CMs are saying it's adequate, right? By not leaving?



I never said I was better than anyone.



Interesting. So people that don't do their job well don't deserve your "living wage"?



Socialism was discredited a lot of years ago. Paying someone more than their services are worth doesn't make sense. Do you pay your hair cutter more if she has a baby? I know you think you can force those greedy executives to support those poor souls who somehow unlucked themselves into four kids on a CM salary, but the making the salary higher would only really hit Disney investors, the majority of which are elderly retirees on fixed income.

You don’t think that they are worth more than they are paid? You must not think much of what they do. And I am not talking about socialism. I am talking about an employee being paid a living wage. They are, in fact, working for their paycheck. Not talking about a handout here.

I find it hilarious how many times, right here on this site, it’s said how WDW is one of Florida’s biggest employers. And you think all of those are college kids? Those bus drivers sure are old college kids. And a lot of those working the janitorial staff. And many of those working the hotel desks. And in many other jobs around those parks.

Paying for his education, knowledge and experience would be paying him for the job he has done. That’s where experience and knowledge comes in.

If those folks you don’t think are worth much didn’t do their jobs well, he wouldn’t have the success he does. It’s simply a fact. No business on the planet will succeed without good employees.

Saying that because someone doesn’t go looking for a job must mean they are happy with their pay is unrealistic and completely out of touch. There are many reasons why someone may stay at a job they have.

 

[pahoben]

A very large percentage of CMs are young, single, and glad to have the experience working at Disney. If they thought they were underpaid, they have other options, but they choose to stay, which means they agree to their salary. If they weren't happy, they would do what all of us do when we can do better: we enter the job market.


The CMs are saying it's adequate, right? By not leaving?



I never said I was better than anyone.



Interesting. So people that don't do their job well don't deserve your "living wage"?



Socialism was discredited a lot of years ago. Paying someone more than their services are worth doesn't make sense. Do you pay your hair cutter more if she has a baby? I know you think you can force those greedy executives to support those poor souls who somehow unlucked themselves into four kids on a CM salary, but the making the salary higher would only really hit Disney investors, the majority of which are elderly retirees on fixed income.

It seems to me that the problem with this (not ethical or moral but just simple practical problem) is that what happens with these marginalized people as we go forward. All that many people can provide to the economy are labor or simple services. If they are compensated at poverty wages for that which they are capable of providing then what options do they have?

A very large percentage of CMs are young, single, and glad to have the experience working at Disney. If they thought they were underpaid, they have other options, but they choose to stay, which means they agree to their salary. If they weren't happy, they would do what all of us do when we can do better: we enter the job market.


The CMs are saying it's adequate, right? By not leaving?



I never said I was better than anyone.



Interesting. So people that don't do their job well don't deserve your "living wage"?



Socialism was discredited a lot of years ago. Paying someone more than their services are worth doesn't make sense. Do you pay your hair cutter more if she has a baby? I know you think you can force those greedy executives to support those poor souls who somehow unlucked themselves into four kids on a CM salary, but the making the salary higher would only really hit Disney investors, the majority of which are elderly retirees on fixed income.

I personally would rather pay more for services to people that have low paying jobs rather than paying for their care through government assistance programs.

When people throw around capitalism versus socialism it just doesn’t capture the complex reality of well...reality. No one of us wants to see children in the US go hungry. We all have some social conscience no matter if we see ourselves as capitalists or socialists as conservatives or progressives as males or females as caucasians or other. I know we all agree American children shouldn’t go hungry.

Many of the well paying labor jobs have been exported and you have cheap labor flooding across the border and you have technological trends that will further marginalize low skilled people.
To just say in principle that low skilled people US citizens should be left to the vagaries of the marketplace ignores what will happen if that is in fact what happens.

If you want to avoid socialism you need to make sure capitalism is working for a majority of people that can vote. If it isn’t then socialism becomes increasingly likely. No matter how bad a person believes that to be it is just the reality of the situation.

My preference is to pay low skilled US citizens more then accept what are likely to be the much worse alternatives. To say that US labor rightfully should compete with labor in China or Viet Nam is a short sighted recipe for disaster in my view. To say that those at the bottom are better receiving government assistance rather than a higher wage is again a recipe for disaster in my view.

The overall distortions to efficiency of the economy will likely be worse if you don’t pay people at the bottom a decent wage.

 

[PasadenaJacket]

You don’t think that they are worth more than they are paid? You must not think much of what they do.

I said nothing about what they are worth. I said they should be paid the value of their services. If they clean toilets at Disney all day, they probably should be paid about the same as someone who cleans toilets all day at a nearby office building, right? And if the businesses are told "you have to pay them much more because of their financial situation", those businesses would probably revisit whether it is worth it have their toilets cleaned as often, right? Work has a value to the buyer, and if you ask someone to pay more than the work is worth, then they will find something else. That's what anyone would do. As the steward of my family's money, I have an obligation to get the best value for the money I spend, so I can keep some for my children.

And I am not talking about socialism. I am talking about an employee being paid a living wage. They are, in fact, working for their paycheck. Not talking about a handout here.

I find it hilarious how many times, right here on this site, it’s said how WDW is one of Florida’s biggest employers. And you think all of those are college kids? Those bus drivers sure are old college kids. And a lot of those working the janitorial staff. And many of those working the hotel desks. And in many other jobs around those parks.

Paying for his education, knowledge and experience would be paying him for the job he has done. That’s where experience and knowledge comes in.

If those folks you don’t think are worth much didn’t do their jobs well, he wouldn’t have the success he does. It’s simply a fact. No business on the planet will succeed without good employees.

Saying that because someone doesn’t go looking for a job must mean they are happy with their pay is unrealistic and completely out of touch. There are many reasons why someone may stay at a job they have.

It's not unrealistic at all! If you truly have the talents and energy to get a better job than your current position but don't seek another position, you are a fool! So if you stay in your job you are admitting that you can't do better.

 

[PasadenaJacket]

If you want to avoid socialism you need to make sure capitalism is working for a majority of people that can vote. If it isn’t then socialism becomes increasingly likely.

Not worried about this. Anyone who has tried socialism can testify how miserable it is.

 

[luvsJack]

I said nothing about what they are worth. I said they should be paid the value of their services. If they clean toilets at Disney all day, they probably should be paid about the same as someone who cleans toilets all day at a nearby office building, right? And if the businesses are told "you have to pay them much more because of their financial situation", those businesses would probably revisit whether it is worth it have their toilets cleaned as often, right? Work has a value to the buyer, and if you ask someone to pay more than the work is worth, then they will find something else. That's what anyone would do. As the steward of my family's money, I have an obligation to get the best value for the money I spend, so I can keep some for my children.

It's not unrealistic at all! If you truly have the talents and energy to get a better job than your current position but don't seek another position, you are a fool! So if you stay in your job you are admitting that you can't do better.

Spoken as someone who has never been in a situation where changing jobs is not feasible. That doesn’t always make someone a fool. It makes them a human being in real life.

I didn’t say they should be paid more because of their financial situation. Where do you even get that? I said they should be paid a living wage.

Disney cannot NOT have the person to clean the toilets. If they do, there is going to be a mess in the parks. Are you going to continue paying the ridiculous amount of money we all pay to visit parks with messy bathrooms? Nor can they do without wait staff or cooks or bus drivers. See, that’s what you aren’t getting. Disney needs these people to do these jobs. Goes back to the fact that Iger is only successful because of the people under him.

Yes, work has value to the employer. I ran a small business for years. Child care center. I could match the pay of other centers and pay minimum and get minimum employees. But I had people whose job it was to take care of children. I wanted the best caregivers I could get. So I paid above what other centers paid. As such, I had little turn over in a business that is well known to have a huge turnover. And as such, I had a successful business. But I was successful because of my employees. In business, the best value of your money isn’t always spending less.

Minimum wage was supposed to go up years ago. It was supposed to be a living wage. Now Disney is raising the pay of the employees. I think it will be at $13 an hour in September. But how many have noticed cuts in numbers of CMs? Or how many have had their hours cut? Full time is 32 hours. Not what full time should be. So while their hourly wage may be up, how many are actually bringing home more?

 

[PasadenaJacket]

Spoken as someone who has never been in a situation where changing jobs is not feasible.

In America we are blessed with an extremely fluid and high-wage job market (thanks to capitalism). So, yes, if you have the talents and energy for a higher paying, you can get one.

I didn’t say they should be paid more because of their financial situation. Where do you even get that? I said they should be paid a living wage.

You> "They are paid below the poverty level for a family of four"

Disney cannot NOT have the person to clean the toilets. If they do, there is going to be a mess in the parks. Are you going to continue paying the ridiculous amount of money we all pay to visit parks with messy bathrooms? Nor can they do without wait staff or cooks or bus drivers.

Agreed

Disney needs these people to do these jobs. Goes back to the fact that Iger is only successful because of the people under him.

Here's where your argument breaks down. It's true Disney needs people, but it doesn't need _these_ people, it just needs people willing and able to do the job. If everyone quit today, Disney would be stuck for a few days, but they could announce a small pay raise (because they're desperate), and have more than enough applicants beat a path to their door.

Yes, work has value to the employer. I ran a small business for years. Child care center. I could match the pay of other centers and pay minimum and get minimum employees. But I had people whose job it was to take care of children. I wanted the best caregivers I could get. So I paid above what other centers paid. As such, I had little turn over in a business that is well known to have a huge turnover. And as such, I had a successful business. But I was successful because of my employees. In business, the best value of your money isn’t always spending less.

Awesome, bully for you. You sound like a 1 in 20 CEO. But Iger is a 1 in a billion CEO. And he has created huge amounts of wealth (created, not moved) for millions of people (the majority of whom are elderly retirees on fixed incomes) while paying a wage you disagree with.

Minimum wage was supposed to go up years ago. It was supposed to be a living wage. Now Disney is raising the pay of the employees. I think it will be at $13 an hour in September. But how many have noticed cuts in numbers of CMs? Or how many have had their hours cut? Full time is 32 hours. Not what full time should be. So while their hourly wage may be up, how many are actually bringing home more?

Hey, that may suck in the short term for CMs. But the market is always evolving, and in America, it's always improved. 100 years ago, 90% of us were farmers. If you had told all the farmers 100 years ago that most farming jobs would go away, I'm sure they would have panicked.

 

[luvsJack]

In America we are blessed with an extremely fluid and high-wage job market (thanks to capitalism). So, yes, if you have the talents and energy for a higher paying, you can get one.


You> "They are paid below the poverty level for a family of four"


Agreed



Here's where your argument breaks down. It's true Disney needs people, but it doesn't need _these_ people, it just needs people willing and able to do the job. If everyone quit today, Disney would be stuck for a few days, but they could announce a small pay raise (because they're desperate), and have more than enough applicants beat a path to their door.



Awesome, bully for you. You sound like a 1 in 20 CEO. But Iger is a 1 in a billion CEO. And he has created huge amounts of wealth (created, not moved) for millions of people (the majority of whom are elderly retirees on fixed incomes) while paying a wage you disagree with.



Hey, that may suck in the short term for CMs. But the market is always evolving, and in America, it's always improved. 100 years ago, 90% of us were farmers. If you had told all the farmers 100 years ago that most farming jobs would go away, I'm sure they would have panicked.

You aren’t getting what I am saying. There are reasons people do not change jobs. Location, needed insurance, hours, etc. Not just Disney, but any job. If you haven’t been in that situation, you will fail to understand it.

You keep insinuating that I have an issue with capitalism. I don’t, I am all for it. I have an issue with people not being able to live (as in pay for the basics of life) on their pay. I, in no way, support socialism.

I wasn’t comparing myself to Iger . I was simply saying that valuing your employees is a plus in business. But from the sounds of it, he values them more than you do. If I had to guess, I would strongly suspect that he knows how valuable the employees are.

You have the attitude of a man dh worked for many years ago. He ran a trucking company and made the mistake of having the attitude that “truck drivers are a dime a dozen”. Where is he today? Well, he has no company. It went bankrupt. He couldn’t keep drivers. Successful business owners and CEOs (like Iger) know how valuable these people are. On the flip side is the man who built his trucking company from one truck to a mult-million dollar company and did it by valuing his drivers and taking care of them. Or another who did the same with a construction company.

Farmers are still around. And some still make big bucks. They had to evolve of course. But the changes in agriculture are not comparable to employees pay being raised and hours cut.

You keep saying that he has “built huge amounts of wealth” and “elderly retirees on a fixed income” in the same sentence. If they now have huge amounts of wealth, they are no longer on a fixed income. You are contradicting yourself. And the wealth wasn’t built because of not paying a living wage. That isn’t how Iger has succeeded as well as he has. He has built it in what he has done with the company and the ridiculous amounts of money we all pay for the pleasure of enjoying said company.

Iger has done great things with this company. I just hope it doesn’t go so far away from what the Disney brother’s wanted that it loses sight of their vision. But that is just me.

And I will always believe strongly that a man or woman that works hard every day should be able to support themselves and their family. Apparently you think that is only for the chosen few.

 

[middlechild]

Once again, nothing can or should be assumed. Part time at WDW does NOT mean automatically you are being paid minimum wage. Many of the part time employees are part of union representation. WDW has also agreed to increase minimum wage to $15 an hour in the next year or so.
Percent of workers that make minimum:
https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2016/home.htmMany of the represented workers are getting a raise:
https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/tourism/os-bz-disney-union-contract-20180822-story.htmlTo make the discussion fair, we have to agree or disagree that there ARE non-represented workers, head of household, with four kids, attempting to cover life expenses by working part time at WDW.

The argument is not so simple, when you start getting specific. Can someone support a family of four on $7.25 (federal minimum) or $8.46 (Florida minimum), working 20 hours a week at WDW? No. Should they be able to? No.

 

[luvsJack]

Once again, nothing can or should be assumed. Part time at WDW does NOT mean automatically you are being paid minimum wage. Many of the part time employees are part of union representation. WDW has also agreed to increase minimum wage to $15 an hour in the next year or so.
Percent of workers that make minimum:
https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2016/home.htmMany of the represented workers are getting a raise:
https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/tourism/os-bz-disney-union-contract-20180822-story.htmlTo make the discussion fair, we have to agree or disagree that there ARE non-represented workers, head of household, with four kids, attempting to cover life expenses by working part time at WDW.

The argument is not so simple, when you start getting specific. Can someone support a family of four on $7.25 (federal minimum) or $8.46 (Florida minimum), working 20 hours a week at WDW? No. Should they be able to? No.

At 20 hours? No. At full time hours? Yes. At what minimum wage is? Of course they can't. They can't even pay rent for one person let alone a family. But they should be able to at least take care of one person.

Full time at Disney is said to be 32 hours, not 40. Does a 32 hour person get full time benefits?

I do commend Disney for raising their pay. I think it will be at $13 an hour in September and then rise from there. But if they are raising their hourly pay and cutting their hours, then they are only trying to LOOK good not actually doing anything.

 

[cranbiz]

At 20 hours? No. At full time hours? Yes. At what minimum wage is? Of course they can't. They can't even pay rent for one person let alone a family. But they should be able to at least take care of one person.

Full time at Disney is said to be 32 hours, not 40. Does a 32 hour person get full time benefits?

I do commend Disney for raising their pay. I think it will be at $13 an hour in September and then rise from there. But if they are raising their hourly pay and cutting their hours, then they are only trying to LOOK good not actually doing anything.

Actually, all Disney cast members can have benefits in FL (not sure about the CT's but FT and CR do). part time or full time. The plans and company contributions are a bit different but workers who work under 32 hours a week and over 32 hours a week qualify for benefits.

Pay does depend on role, as a bus driver we got more to start than an attractions CM. Back in 2006, my starting pay was $12.94 an hour as a CR bus driver. We were also limited by DOT to only 60 hours in an 8 day period where other CM's could work more.

Those CM's who had hours cut can easily get more hours thru the shift exchange. There was always shift availability there so you had the ability to make more money if you wanted to.

Where do you draw the line for a living wage? Some people work for Disney for the perks, some for the benefits and some because they are trying to make a living. However, no one has to work for any employer. If you don't like the wage, look elsewhere. Did I want to make more money? Sure, who doesn't. Did I think I was unfairly compensated, no. DW and I lived on what WDW paid me for 6 months until I found another IT position (and I stayed CR after getting that position). Was it hard, Hell yes. Was it doable, yes, it was.

 

[Love Tink]

Socialism was discredited a lot of years ago.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Have you heard of France? Italy? Iceland? Germany? Ireland? Sweden? The UK? Portugal?

Maybe you aren't into Europe. Brazil? Peru? Ecuador?

Only the truly ignorant are so certain of their positions.

 

[Love Tink]

Not worried about this. Anyone who has tried socialism can testify how miserable it is.

Five of the top ten countries in the world ranked by the reported happiness of their people are Democratic Socialist countries.

 

[luvsJack]

Actually, all Disney cast members can have benefits in FL (not sure about the CT's but FT and CR do). part time or full time. The plans and company contributions are a bit different but workers who work under 32 hours a week and over 32 hours a week qualify for benefits.

Pay does depend on role, as a bus driver we got more to start than an attractions CM. Back in 2006, my starting pay was $12.94 an hour as a CR bus driver. We were also limited by DOT to only 60 hours in an 8 day period where other CM's could work more.

Those CM's who had hours cut can easily get more hours thru the shift exchange. There was always shift availability there so you had the ability to make more money if you wanted to.

Where do you draw the line for a living wage? Some people work for Disney for the perks, some for the benefits and some because they are trying to make a living. However, no one has to work for any employer. If you don't like the wage, look elsewhere. Did I want to make more money? Sure, who doesn't. Did I think I was unfairly compensated, no. DW and I lived on what WDW paid me for 6 months until I found another IT position (and I stayed CR after getting that position). Was it hard, Hell yes. Was it doable, yes, it was.

12.94 in 2006 is quite a bit more than it is in 2019. Good to know the drivers make more. Honestly, saying they can just work more shifts doesn't justify their hours being cut. I mean its not like business was down, so what was the reason?

There is a definitive line for a living wage. Its a wage that a person, with a family, can pay for the basic necessities of life with. Food, shelter, clothing.

 

[TraceySavannah]

 

[pahoben]

Not worried about this. Anyone who has tried socialism can testify how miserable it is.

Is this serious? You are claiming that every person that lived under socialism will testify how miserable it is? Sounds like a typical ideologue but on the right rather than the typical left wing ideologue. Very simple black and white model of life you have there. A poor model of reality but at least it is simple.

Many people would classify the US now as socialism with taxes redistributing wealth from one group to another. I take it you don’t subscribe to that?

There already are min wage laws in the US. Is that something you can accommodate in your pure model of capitalism?

If sufficient number of people have a difficult time providing for their family in any society then the wheels fall off. I don’t know where all the high paying jobs you are referring to are located in the US because most of them are being done by essentially slave labor in China now. It used to be that a family could be well provided for with a single wage earner. That changed to well provided for with two wage earners. That changed to two wage earners and a couple checks from missing a mortgage payment.

The trends for the future Suggest these problems will worsen with further technological displacement of significant numbers of workers. This has started a discussion of universal income schemes. There will be an ever increasing number of people that have difficulty providing high demand skills for a good wage. It has nothing to do with their willingness to work but they will just not be able to learn the technical skills that will be in demand.

 

[Truxi]

...they always bring up Venezuela like some kind of "gotcha" and completely ignore every other country with better practices than ours... it's like clockwork.

I don’t think Walt would approve of much of the messaging.

I mean, Walt literally made propaganda films, so he wasn't opposed to using his work to hammer in a message without subtlety.

That said, given his time frame, Walt probably wouldn't approve of a lot of modern thought. Probably wouldn't have much liked the Little Mermaid and Jasmine being so sexualized (remember when he fired Harlan Ellison after just overhearing a sex joke about one of his characters?).

The "messaging" in Captain Marvel was way less overt than, say, Winter Soldier, but it's always the one I hear guys complaining about.