What services should you have to pay for?

[Art 1]

I'll bet he wishes he had paid the $75 now.

 

[Mad4Mickey]

Not real fireman to say the least . I will take all the flames anyone wants to hand out on this one

 

[DMRick]

I would just like to think that it is totally UnAmerican to stand by, watch someone's house burn down and their pets killed.

So, do you know if that's what happened? That the house was still standing and the pets alive in the time they could have gotten there? If so, why didn't the owners get the pets out..if there was all this time. I assume the fire department would have had a ways to come even if they started out immediately, if they were in the next county.

UnAmerican? I don't get that part. I would think it would be immoral for anyone to do that, from any country. However, I still don't know if they lose their jobs, or what the consequences are if they did come, knowing he didn't sign up for their service. It appears from that interview, that this isn't the first time this has happened..so what would be different this time? Why wasn't there an outrage in the past?

Are we just not getting all the facts?

 

[Judy from Boise]

You have to keep in mind that the firefighters are employees who were no doubt following their employer's instructions, which in turn were based on liability. If they fought a fire for someone with whom they had no legal relationship, they would be under no protection from their liability carrier.
We do the same thing in hospitals. When someone has a heart attack in the parking lot we call 911 even though we have a code team right inside the door. We have no legal relationship with a random person in the parking lot, so calling 911 and performing bystander CPR are the only actions we can take.

 

[kaytieeldr]

But, what if someone was inside, he still didn't pay his $75.00. I wonder what would happen then. Would the fire dept still not respond, would you be ok with that?
This fire dept is getting paid by another county from what I understand, send the man a bill, put a lien on his property.

Nope. It appears they were onhand - remember, they did respond, they simply didn't extinguish the fire in this man's home - to prevent the fire from spreading, and likely to rescue anyone who might have been trapped in the burning building. They just weren't authorized to put out this one fire.

IMO, they should have stopped the fire then billed the guy for every penny related to the rescue plus some stiff penalties.

If the homeowner didn't pay the $75, for whatever reason, what makes anyone think he'd pay a huge bill and/or stiff penalties?

 

[kaytieeldr]

this isn't rocket science folks. its helping another human being out who didn't pay the cheaper fee.. here is another point where common sense has gone out the window...

Human being, had that been necessary, sure. A building? Nope.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I would sue the town.

Except he doesn't live in any town. He lives in an unincorporated "something" - sorry, I heard this on the radio about twelve hours ago, I think they said 'area of the county' or something. He was aware of the fee, of the necessity to pay the fee, to be entitled to fire protection service from the nearby city/town. It's similar - not identical, but similar - to many communities charging for trash collection. If you want them to pick up your trash, you pay for the service. If you don't want to pay, they don't pick up your trash. It's not identical because trash pickup or the lack of it doesn't affect having a roof over your head.

 

[pumba21]

Wow I never thought our town would make the DISBOARDS!! If you do not live in the city limits of any town in the county you do not have fire protection. Many of the towns have a volunteer fire department that their community supports. South Fulton does not have one. It would have taken way too long for any of the other volunteer departments to get to the fire.
I have mixed feeling about the whole incident. I do not blame the firefighters at all, they were doing as they were told. The man should have paid his fee and should not expect them to be there if and only if he needs them. Hopefully this will prompt people to look at the policies and considered tacking on the fee to some bill that everyone pays (not water because if you live in the county you probably have well water)

 

[loxie]

Whether he paid his bill or not. Its completely disgusting for firefighters to sit there & let poor innocent animals die because if it... They should of at least saved them or anyone who may have been inside.

 

[barkley]

When you buy a house, you'll know whether or not it's in the city limits. I don't know if anyone would think to point out that this means you may not be entitled to city services.

if you've educated yourself as a buyer, esp. when it comes to buying a home in a rural area not within city limits-this is something you will be aware of. even if you don't find out on your own, your prospective homeowner's insurance carrier is likely to educate you on it (and i would be surprised it would'nt be a condition of coverage to keep the fee paid up).

but it never ceases to amaze me at how little people who are buying outside the city limits and ESP. RURALY do not think in a rational matter about what lving "out here" means. the first shock to them is usualy "what do you mean my kid can't go to 'middle of nowhere highschool', i live in 'middle of nowhere'"-um, no you don't-you live in the county, which is adjacent to 'middle of nowhere' which has the closest post office, that's the only reason it's our mailing address. your kids go to the district we are zoned for (when they bought in a city did'nt they look at school district boundaries???).

the second "shocker" is when there's a massive power outage (talking about county/city wide), then it's "what do you mean my neighborhood is'nt the top priority for the utility trucks, what about the street lights and public safety?!", um nope-top priority is the city, with not so rural county being next-while you make an excellent point about the streetlights and public safety, seeing as the closest streetlight to your home is 3 miles in one direction and 20 in another, that's not a great argument to get the utility trucks out here sooner

but the biggest shocker comes when they have their first experience with snow-"where are the snow plows? what do you mean the city or county does'nt plow out here???!!!" dude-did you NOT read your title papers, do you not realize that the crappy piece of dirt with minimal gravel leading up to your home from someone elses dirt and gravel road is YOUR PRIVATE PROPERTY??? no.........the city near us only plows within city limits, and the county only gets to plowing the remote county rodes after they get the main arteries done (though kudo to our county plowers, they do an awsome job).

i honestly think the people who make the idiots guide books should write one up on purchasing ruraly


we live ruraly, and any kind of services that the city nearest us offers that we can opt into (for a fee) we receive regular notification of (anyone with a mailing address that lists that city receives these notices-which is all of us).

as far as services go-we have volunteer fire departments which are very responsive for fire and medical emergencies (although the county fire departments and the adjenct cities work co-operativly for larger scale fires). we don't pay for water because we have wells, or sewage because we have drain fields and septic systems. we do pay for garbage, but i've never lived anywhere city or county or county rural where it was without a fee.

the most complex fee for service stucture i ever lived under was in the city we lived in northern california. the city had designated garbage and water/sewage as public health issues. it was mandatory you sign up for these, but if you failed to pay the bills the services would not stop-and the city put a lien on your home (landlords could not let renters sign up for these services, they had to maintain them in their own name for private homes). the other services like police and fire were paid through our property taxes BUT because the city had expanded over a relativly short period of time and had to build/expand fire/police stations/equipment/forces, those that lived in the newer homes bought in with bonds attached to those home for the first 15 years to offset those costs (added several hundreds of dollars per year to your mortgage payment). right before we moved the city passed a new fee for service-there was a terrible number of police response calls to homes because of cheaply installed or improperly operated home security systems, so a cap was set on the number of times the police would respond to false alarms, afterwhich the homeowner would get hit with a $75 per false alarm fee (people got allot better at properly arming their systems after that).

 

[Buckalew11]

The man knew that living where he lived he had no fire protection w/o paying the $75. It is a fact of life around here. Live in the city, have city fire protection. Live in the county, you pay a yearly fee for protection.

I moved to the county 1 yr. ago and pay more than the $75 for mine and started paying it before we even built the house.

Around here, even if you live in the city, you'll pay if you are transported in an ambulance whether it is emergency or non-emergency. You can subscribe to that for a yearly fee also--city or county. Most older folks do that and if you have a chronic illness you do but otherwise, in general, people do not choose to pay that fee.

My head understands the concept of the man did not pay so "no service for you." However, how a FF could stand there and let someone's house burn down is still hard for me to take in.
I've watched a trailer fire before (while DH was fighting it) and it was fast and furious and extremely scary for me.

I asked DH, a FF for over 25 yrs., about his opinion on this and he said "they'd have to just fire me because I would have fought it."
And, I'm sure he is right, no way would he have stood by and watched--right or wrong--job or no job.

I'm betting if the FF had fought the fire and gotten fired for it that there would have been such an outcry that something would have to give. Maybe I'm wrong.

However, I am glad to know that I'm married to the kind of man who'd fight that fire.

 

[Carly_Roach]

I would just like to think that it is totally UnAmerican to stand by, watch someone's house burn down and their pets killed.

I don't get the UnAmerican part. I don't believe this has anything to do with being an American or a Canadian or a Mexican or whatever. Of course, if this were a Socialist or Communist society then the trailer would have been saved because everyone would have had fire protection. But this isn't a Socialist or Communist society. Obviously.

Whether he paid his bill or not. Its completely disgusting for firefighters to sit there & let poor innocent animals die because if it... They should of at least saved them or anyone who may have been inside.

I believe it was already established by the phone call that no one was inside, therefore no lives were lost. If animals were inside, then it would have been the homeowner's responsibility to get them out, not the fire department's. Obviously the animals weren't all that important to the homeower or he would have made an effort to remove them from the home before it was too late.

I know it's been mentioned before here, but people are overlooking the fact that the house was a trailer which can go up in flames very quickly, and the man chose to live in a rural area that didn't have fire protection so it would have taken awhile for the engines and water tankers to get to him anyway. Heck, even if he'd have paid the $75 there's no guarantee the fire department would have been there in time to save his trailer.

As for the "pay the fee after the fire's been put out" argument, it could be that this tactic has already been tried with several homes and the city has had just as much luck getting the money for services rendered as they did getting the money for the $75.00 fee before any fire has broken out. You can bill, but that's no guarantee that you'll collect. And you may wind up spending more money trying to collect on a bad debt thereby throwing good money after bad.

And yet this person who was careless with their trash burning is out no money AND has received services that everyone else paid for.

It may be time for the city to re-think their generous plan of offering fire services to county folk for nominal fees. Perhaps then folks will understand that fire protection in a rural area where there is no fire protection is a service paid for by the citizens of that city and not a right for everyone living within a 100 mile radius of that service to enjoy.

 

[Buckalew11]

It may be time for the city to re-think their generous plan of offering fire services to county folk for nominal fees. Perhaps then folks will understand that fire protection in a rural area where there is no fire protection is a service paid for by the citizens of that city and not a right for everyone living within a 100 mile radius of that service to enjoy.

You may know this info better than I do because each area can be different and I haven't even looked to see what Fulton's is, but in our county, I am not covered by the city closest to me. Our county has it's own FD and that is who I subscribe from. It used to be a volunteer department and but it is very possibly a paid department now (sadly, I'm not sure).

By living in the county, I do not even have the option of city trash pickup or fire service. Everyone has the same ambulance service though (city or county) and no one is covered by that service through their taxes.

 

[tlbwriter]

Originally Posted by tlbwriter
But the fee goes to a town these people don't live in. They can't simply add a fee to the tax statements of non-residents.

I'm sure something can be worked out with the town. There is some mechanism that be put into place with regard to billing so that this does not happen again.

They DID work something out with the town. And he chose not to participate. What else do you think they should do? They can't "work something out" that forces non-residents to pay a fee to the city.

 

[tlbwriter]

I would just like to think that it is totally UnAmerican to stand by, watch someone's house burn down and their pets killed.

Well, I'm not sure how it's un-American, but it is sad. And that's why I wonder why the homeowner did it - stood there and watched his house catch on fire and didn't get his animals out.

 

[golfgal]

So, now he is stating that his house was underinsured as well Those dang insurance companies, trying to rip you off getting you to pay more so you are covered properly --it's just a sad situation all the way around but again, our country is SO lacking in any personal responsibility it doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

 

[HelenePA]

Human being, had that been necessary, sure. A building? Nope.

Is anyone even sure they would have done anything then? These people are NOT firemen... Sorry I know A Lot of them... They are nothing like these people who stood there and watched... Like I said before SHAME On them... SHAME SHAME SHAME!!!

 

[Hannathy]

So, now he is stating that his house was underinsured as well Those dang insurance companies, trying to rip you off getting you to pay more so you are covered properly --it's just a sad situation all the way around but again, our country is SO lacking in any personal responsibility it doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

And as someone else said earlier wonder if he informed his insurance he had no fire dept service? I would think that has to raise your premium substantially. I know ours they even want to know how far away the fire hydrant is let alone whether you have someone who could come and use it!

I abhor that he took a gamble and lost and instead of dealing with it he ran to the press.

 

[Hannathy]

Is anyone even sure they would have done anything then? These people are NOT firemen... Sorry I know A Lot of them... They are nothing like these people who stood there and watched... Like I said before SHAME On them... SHAME SHAME SHAME!!!

they did do something they kept the fire from spreading. Fireman often stand and watch a fire if it is too far gone to do anything with and just keep it from spreading. The priority is to keep the firefighters alive first, then save people, then fight the fire. If they weren't on the scene of a trailer fire with in a few minutes there would have been nothing for them to do but watch anyway and from the sounds of it they were more than a few minutes away.

Sorry pet lovers -and I am one also- they don't risk a firefighters life for an animal. Kinda hard to explain to a child that they don't have a Daddy or Mommy anymore cause they died trying to save an animal from a raging fire.

 

[mhsjax]

they did do something they kept the fire from spreading. Fireman often stand and watch a fire if it is too far gone to do anything with and just keep it from spreading. The priority is to keep the firefighters alive first, then save people, then fight the fire. If they weren't on the scene of a trailer fire with in a few minutes there would have been nothing for them to do but watch anyway and from the sounds of it they were more than a few minutes away.

Sorry pet lovers -and I am one also- they don't risk a firefighters life for an animal. Kinda hard to explain to a child that they don't have a Daddy or Mommy anymore cause they died trying to save an animal from a raging fire.

Yeah, I will have to back peddle on that one. I have seen mobile homes go up, they are like paper burning. there is no way that a fireman could have gone in and saved animals without getting killed or severely injured.

I will leave it at that.