Retheme Splash Mountain?

[GoingSince1990]

Hi,
Just curious. If this ride were to change the 2 main characters to say a Wolf and a pig, would this appease the general public? Also if that were to happen, what would it say about whether we think this ride is wrong and should be changed? I think Disney saw the original movie as a mistake, changed it by erasing it to the best of their ability, and learned by changing the characters to a different story altogether. Is this not what everyone is supposed to be doing? Learning from past mistakes and changing to the best of our abilities? Also, if we were going to go further, couldn't we just change their names to Bailey rabbit and Burt fox?

When you say

I think Disney saw the original movie as a mistake, changed it by erasing it to the best of their ability, and learned by changing the characters to a different story altogether

it sounds as though you are under the misconception that Song of the South is an animated movie starring the character Brer Rabbit. It’s not. Brer Rabbit is a traditional character and tale dating back to the 1800s, and Song of the South is a mostly live-action movie during which one of the characters (Uncle Remus) retells the story of Brer Rabbit (with accompanying animated sequences). Splash Mountain is themed to the Brer Rabbit tale, not to the Song of the South movie. The argument that Splash should be re-themed is that Brer Rabbit is “guilty by association” of racism, since he was unfortunate enough to have his story retold by one of the characters in a racially offensive movie.

 

[YeOswaldianSociety]

I don't think the ride should be changed because the vast majority of folks have no clue that it's even connected to a film. I also believe that this is an excellent time to re-release the film on plus and use it as a learning experience. Show how the film whitewashes history through a documentary of some sort. I doubt that this will occur but hiding the film does nothing as copies of it are pretty easy to track down. There's actually an excellent HD version out and about that's pulled directly from the film stock itself.

 

[Disney Frenhines]

Splash Mountain is themed on the stories from Black folklore that were collected by Joel Chandler Harries, while you could argue it is based on the movie, which I have seen by the way, it doesn't feature any of the human characters in the movie, not even Uncle Remus, who is in both the stories and the movie, beautifully played by James Baskett. So you want to get rid of stories that are part of historical black storytelling? If they want to change it then add the fictional storyteller in the original tales, Uncle Remus.
Absolutely do not change Splash Mountain.

 

[Disney Frenhines]

How many of you have actually seen Song of The South in the past decade?

 

[IceSkatingPrincess]

I don't think splash needs to be changed, but I do think Tiana deserves more. It would be great to get a cool new Princess and the Frog ride instead of just a remake overlay. There is a lot they could do with that movie that would make a great standalone attraction! Or a new restaurant... I loved Tiana's Place on DCL. It would be great to have something similar at WDW.

 

[DVCcurious]

As someone with Native American ancestry I’m more offended that people aren’t protesting Peter Pan. I think all references to that horribly racist movie should be removed from the parks.

 

[Paul1955]

I don't think splash needs to be changed, but I do think Tiana deserves more. It would be great to get a cool new Princess and the Frog ride instead of just a remake overlay. There is a lot they could do with that movie that would make a great standalone attraction! Or a new restaurant... I loved Tiana's Place on DCL. It would be great to have something similar at WDW.

I don't think many people would object if the Whinnie the Pooh ride in Disneyland was rethemed to Princess and the Frog. This is not a commentary about the Pooh character and its story line, but the attraction is just not that great.

 

[TarotFox]

Suggesting that Brer Rabbit isn't "from" Splash because the character existed beforehand, while using the exact design, dialogue, etc., from a specific adaptation --that being Song of the South -- is like claiming that Snow White's Adventure isn't based on Snow White, the 1937 movie, but on the Brothers' Grimm.

 

[DuckTalesFan32]

I posed this question before directly to one poster, but I’d like to pose it again to the group at large, and I’m genuinely happy to hear from anyone: For those of you that voted it shouldn’t be changed, do you think offensive themes shouldn’t be changed, period, or is it that you don’t think Song of the South is offensive enough to warrant changing a ride?

I’m asking because I truly believe Song of the South to be incredibly racist material. I can’t imagine what it would feel like to be a black visitor walking past that ride, knowing what the source material is. Humbly, I will be surprised if it doesn’t get changed in the coming years.

So is it that you don’t think we should alter offensive rides, or that this one in particular is not offensive?

I'll admit, I'm not black. But can you really speak for every black visitor? I have black friends who want Disney to rerelease Song of the South from the vault so there can be a meaningful discussion. I've seen black people straight out say they know that Splash Mountain is based on a problematic movie, but that they still love and want to keep the ride. African-Americans and blacks in general don't all think the same. They are their own individuals, with their own ways of thinking.

Now, I'm not trying to rag on you. Even though I don't want them to change Splash Mountain, your feelings are valid. Systemic racism is a great evil and must be fought against. I agree. But I don't see Splash itself as racist.

Will Dinsey change the ride? Maybe. Maybe not. Who knows? I wouldn't be surprised if Disney did change it because they have changed so many things (censored too many things, I feel) in the past. On the other hand, there were so many rumors that Disney was going to censor Dumbo and Peter Pan for Disney Plus, but they didn't, and I think that's because they got a backlash from people in advance. There are tons of polls with people saying they don't want the ride changed. Of course, Disney I think will monitor foot traffic. If traffic dies down heavily for Splash, I would think they would be keener on changing it. But then again, considering they have censored much of their property in the past to appease people, they may do the same thing now.

 

[snowwhite84]

I'll admit, I'm not black. But can you really speak for every black visitor?

Of course I can’t. I speak for no one but myself.

 

[Disney Frenhines]

As someone with Native American ancestry I’m more offended that people aren’t protesting Peter Pan. I think all references to that horribly racist movie should be removed from the parks.

Do you know something, I always thought the same. I actually found it more offensive than Song of The South in it's depiction of Native Americans.

 

[Lumpy1106]

As the OP I wanted say THANK YOU to everyone who has responded and provided their heartfelt comments. This has been a great discussion IMHO and I am a little surprised by the results, but that's why I included the poll - life is full of surprises after all.

The biggest surprise I have found is that, and it's not just this thread, the arguments for changing the ride are not what I expected. I never considered the song, or the story as told on the ride to be offensive. It is the ORIGNAL story of the Tar Baby that I I described on page 1 that I thought was the real (forgive me) sticking point, the modified version of which IS the climatic end to the ride. I just picture a parent going on eBay, buying the book to read to their kids (LOTS of copies are out there - it was in wide distribution at one point) and then discovering WHOA! What the heck? And this is a Disney book? Crazy. The fact that Disney has deemed both the book and the movie to be so offensive that THEY will not release either from the Disney vault, I would think would be reason enough for Disney to red light the project from the start - but then the 80's were a different time, and Eisner was a different sort of CEO.

I can get behind the love people have for this ride and can see why they wouldn't want it changed for this reason. What I can't get behind is the ride should not be changed to, if I am understanding this correctly, SHAME the current Disney higher-ups? Nah - I don't get that. Disney is not perfect, but they are I would say among the most inclusive companies out there. In fact, if not for the current COVID crisis, I would have fully expected Disney to respond to this in some way already. In fact, they sort-of have. Remember that Fredrick Chambers, the guy who put together the displays, IS a Disney employee. Sure, he did it on his free time, but Disney has not spoken out against the idea either. In fact I would not be surprised if they welcome the discussion.

Anyway, I'm digging this thread - definitely worth a bookmark. Keep it coming!

 

[Jenene]

I have to admit, I love splash mountain because I loved the movie, the songs and the story. History is good and bad, but it is history. I do also know Disney is about ever changing and keeping up with innovation and entertainment. I will miss the original ride but look forward to what is next. I just hope if its Princes and the Frog they downplay the evil voodoo doctor.

 

[DuckTalesFan32]

I can get behind the love people have for this ride and can see why they wouldn't want it changed for this reason. What I can't get behind is the ride should not be changed to, if I am understanding this correctly, SHAME the current Disney higher-ups? Nah - I don't get that. Disney is not perfect, but they are I would say among the most inclusive companies out there. In fact, if not for the current COVID crisis, I would have fully expected Disney to respond to this in some way already. In fact, they sort-of have. Remember that Fredrick Chambers, the guy who put together the displays, IS a Disney employee. Sure, he did it on his free time, but Disney has not spoken out against the idea either. In fact I would not be surprised if they welcome the discussion.

Thank you for your civil tone. As for Disney not speaking against the idea, I don't think they want to. They probably feel very pressured right now.

And yes, I agree with people for not wanting to change a ride that is a very beloved classic with tons of foot traffic and long waiting lines.

I would also like to draw attention to this video. This is by an African-American woman (and no, we can't speak for all African Americans or all whites) who is against retheming Splash Mountain. I highly recommend giving this a listen to. It starts at 1:03:18.

 

[Nebraska_Disney]

As the OP I wanted say THANK YOU to everyone who has responded and provided their heartfelt comments. This has been a great discussion IMHO and I am a little surprised by the results, but that's why I included the poll - life is full of surprises after all.

What was surprising? That 3 out of 4 people feel that there is no need to change/fix something which is not broken? Did you ever read Huck Finn (but Tom Sawyer's Island is not even being discussed) ? Huck Finn was one of my all time favorite books and I have probably read it at least 2 dozen times in my life but there is no way it would show up in HS's now (I read it as a soph). I am sure if we dig into every single detail of every single attraction at WDW, we could find something offensive to someone right? I mean, look at Rock N Roll Roller Coaster, it is themed by a group that in the 1970's did so much cocaine, they could not even perform anymore. What about Captain EO (I know that is gone) but the issues that swirled around Michael Jackson. It can go on and on and in the end, no one is happy. Do we all want to be robots in Wall E ?

 

[GoingSince1990]

What was surprising? That 3 out of 4 people feel that there is no need to change/fix something which is not broken? Did you ever read Huck Finn (but Tom Sawyer's Island is not even being discussed) ? Huck Finn was one of my all time favorite books and I have probably read it at least 2 dozen times in my life. I am sure if we did into every single detail of every single attraction at WDW, we could find something offensive to someone right? I mean, look at Rock N Roll Roller Coaster, it is themed by a group that in the 1970's did so much cocaine, they could not even perform anymore. What about Captain EO (I know that is gone) but the issues that swirled around Michael Jackson. It can go on and on and in the end, no one is happy. Do we all want to be robots in Wall E ?

I found another one! Eric Idle, who plays Dr Nigel Channing in Figment, used to be in Monty Python, which definitely did some sketches in the seventies that are offensive by present-day standards. Disney is an absolute treasure trove for those who love to find things to be offended by.

 

[Lumpy1106]

What was surprising? That 3 out of 4 people feel that there is no need to change/fix something which is not broken? Did you ever read Huck Finn (but Tom Sawyer's Island is not even being discussed) ? Huck Finn was one of my all time favorite books and I have probably read it at least 2 dozen times in my life. I am sure if we did into every single detail of every single attraction at WDW, we could find something offensive to someone right? I mean, look at Rock N Roll Roller Coaster, it is themed by a group that in the 1970's did so much cocaine, they could not even perform anymore. What about Captain EO (I know that is gone) but the issues that swirled around Michael Jackson. It can go on and on and in the end, no one is happy. Do we all want to be robots in Wall E ?

Keep in mind, this is not a big angry protest to get the ride changed - just an idea that was fleshed out as a possible alternative that some people (albeit from this thread, a decided minority) felt was worthy of more serious consideration. It is not the "frog contingent" that have shown by their actions that they feel the material is offensive, it is DISNEY that has kept the material locked in the vault for that reason. Personally, I don't hide from it. My kids have known form the start what the ORIGINAL story was, and why that is offensive...and we ride it every visit because who doesn't love a good log flume ride?

 

[Lumpy1106]

I found another one! Eric Idle, who plays Dr Nigel Channing in Figment, used to be in Monty Python, which definitely did some sketches in the seventies that are offensive by present-day standards. Disney is an absolute treasure trove for those who love to find things to be offended by.

Wait, what about "Life of Brian"...oh, not that one.
"Meaning of Life"....yeah, no
"Holy Grail"...oh, yeah, that's got some issues
"Ministry of Silly Walks"...hmm
I get your point. Why is it I find all of these funny but find what they did to the Imagination ride to be the most offensive?

 

[goofystitch]

Splash Mountain is one of the best and most popular rides at Disney. You can find a reason to be offended by anything if you look hard enough. Must everything change because we are told by a few that it is offensive?

 

[kimmar067]

Dixie Landings was changed to Port Orleans Riverside because it wasn't considered "PC"....I remember distinctly that it was changed about a week after we had stayed there - the signage, the resort maps, etc.