Change in DAS at Disneyland

[Gentry2004]

I would rather Disney offer accommodations based on need, not what ifs.

That’s every accommodation. All the people with anxiety or autism are theorizing they MAY be overwhelmed in the line. They don’t know for sure. And if we are going to start splitting up parties, then an parent can wait with an Autistic kid outside the line and join the rest of the family (who waited in the line) when they get to the front. That is the same thing people are proposing for people with bathroom problems. I’m tired of people acting like this isn’t as real or as valid as some of these other issues. If they want to decimate the program fine, but don’t single out one disability over another.

 

[DisneyOma]

Thanks for the clarification. I didn’t think Disney would or could discriminate on someones medical needs without the intervention from a qualified doctor.

Universal Studios have just brought in a third party to deal with their Accessibility Card (IBCCES) who are medically qualified to approve/disapprove someone’s medical condition by asking for a doctors letter or diagnosis/proof of disability and reasons for not being able to stand in line. A very fair system that will hopefully cut the abuse. Hopefully Disney will go down this route.

Where does it say on the IBCCES site that a medically qualified person is making decisions about medical conditions? BTW, not all disabilities are medical conditions. And the business that does this side job of the ibcces card is a training/certification business for cognitive disorders - not a medical facility.

For most people with bathroom issues, this accommodation would be fine, but again when dealing with ECVs and/or urgent issues, there needs to be more thought put into the new process. The DAS worked before, but admittedly if too many people get them, then it becomes a useless tool as you can be waiting just as long as everyone else again, so not saying that it should be an all or nothing solution, just that there does need to be a little more thought put into it.

How would someone deal with the urgent issue if it happened right before the ride vehicle, or on the ride? What would the rest of the family do then?

 

[OurBigTrip]

That’s every accommodation. All the people with anxiety or autism are theorizing they MAY be overwhelmed in the line. They don’t know for sure. And if we are going to start splitting up parties, then an parent can wait with an Autistic kid outside the line and join the rest of the family (who waited in the line) when they get to the front. That is the same thing people are proposing for people with bathroom problems. I’m tired of people acting like this isn’t as real or as valid as some of these other issues. If they want to decimate the program fine, but don’t single out one disability over another.

No one is acting like these aren’t real issues, but that doesn’t mean that the accommodation needs to be the same as for other disabilities.

Disney has to provide an accommodation; they are under no obligation, legal or otherwise, to provide a guest-preferred accommodation.

 

[Gentry2004]

No one is acting like these aren’t real issues, but that doesn’t mean that the accommodation needs to be the same as for other disabilities.

Disney has to provide an accommodation; they are under no obligation, legal or otherwise, to provide a guest-preferred accommodation.

Why do 5 people need to wait outside the line with any of them? Answer - they don’t. That is the courtesy that is currently provided. If they are taking it away, they should take it away from everyone.

 

[OurBigTrip]

Why do 5 people need to wait outside the line with any of them? Answer - they don’t. That is the courtesy that is currently provided. If they are taking it away, they should take it away from everyone.

We’ll have to agree to disagree that the DAS should be taken away from everyone.

 

[Gentry2004]

We’ll have to agree to disagree that the DAS should be taken away from everyone.

I don’t think it should be taken away from anyone. I think the hairsplitting is not equitable and not in the spirit of the pass. If they plan to make it a Mental Health/Autism-only pass, they should just say so. But those aren’t the only disabilities deserving of the accommodation. But I’m glad they are taking the word of a sped teacher over a medical doctor.

 

[OurBigTrip]

I don’t think it should be taken away from anyone. I think the hairsplitting is not equitable and not in the spirit of the pass. If they plan to make it a Mental Health/Autism-only pass, they should just say so. But those aren’t the only disabilities deserving of the accommodation. But I’m glad they are taking the word of a sped teacher over a medical doctor.

There are plenty of disabilities that have nothing to do with mental health and/or autism that are best served by the DAS. As for your comment about the word of a sped teacher over a medical doctor, no idea what you're talking about, since Disney isn't asking for any proof for any accommodations.

 

[Gentry2004]

There are plenty of disabilities that have nothing to do with mental health and/or autism that are best served by the DAS. As for your comment about the word of a sped teacher over a medical doctor, no idea what you're talking about, since Disney isn't asking for any proof for any accommodations.

Great. I’m not advocating to take anyone’s accommodation away. And I’m not sure why anyone else would either. I was originally replying to the person (not sure if it was you) who said they didn’t think there should be accommodations for things that “may” happen.

 

[OurBigTrip]

Great. I’m not advocating to take anyone’s accommodation away. And I’m not sure why anyone else would either. I was originally replying to the person (not sure if it was you) who said they didn’t think there should be accommodations for things that “may” happen.

Yep, that’s me. And I’m sticking with that opinion.

 

[Gentry2004]

Yep, that’s me. And I’m sticking with that opinion.

And I’m sticking with the opinion that is 90% of DAS holders.

 

[wrightut]

The reality is that there is no accommodation for any urgent bathroom issues that is going make it better for people suffering from them. Whether it is IBD or bladder incontinence or anything else. I don’t understand why having free rein to leave the line and meet up with your party at the loading area is not a reasonable choice. We have never used a DAS but my understanding is that you often have a wait, even if it’s just short. When urgency hits - you have very little time to get to a bathroom. It doesn’t matter where in line you are.

I am sympathetic to people who feel like this isn’t feasible. But it seems like instead of trying it some are angry because they feel like they have been disrespected or that their disability is being looked at as not as “bad”. I just think that’s a stretch.

 

[HopperFan]

It used to be that wheelchairs could not go through lines and needed an alternate entrance. Disney World renovated most all the rides to allow for wheelchairs & ECVs to be accessible - those guests no longer needed an alternate entrance. No longer needed a return time.

When the GAC changed to a DAS, many guests lost their disability pass because their needs were being handled at each attraction based on their needs. They no longer needed the disability pass.

I imagine that Disney is once again looking at changes. It has the data to know - What is the reason someone gets the DAS and how many in each category? - How many DAS are issued in any given time and how many guests are attached to that DAS? - How many DAS times are booked? - How many DAS times are used? - How is this impacting the Lightening Lanes? If they are finding there is a big impact, is it possible they will offer a different accommodation that will have less of an impact on operations?

When they first shifted to DAS, narrowing the scope of the use - my interpretation was that the DAS was now for those whose issues were triggered as a direct result of being in the queue space. There are plenty of guests who have reasons why they would like the accommodation, especially since Genie+ is now fee based, but Disney can offer a different accommodation.

We know that Disney is completely in ADA compliant and they go over and above in the accessible arena. What Disney does above and beyond is their decision. Their Disability Pass will always be fluid and subject to change. It is up to us guests to determine if what they offer is suitable for us to go - it is a luxury unnecessary vacation. At one point we had to stop going for a few years because what Disney offered was not enough for DS at that time. It was up to us to wait until we could manage his needs within the constraints Disney offered.

I am expecting as the parks become more and more crowded again that we'll see either a tightening of the DAS or possibly a completely new program with tighter parameters. And if DS does not get approved then we will do what we can using Genie+. It is our job to make it work with what they are offering.

 

[starlite_]

The reality is that there is no accommodation for any urgent bathroom issues that is going make it better for people suffering from them. Whether it is IBD or bladder incontinence or anything else. I don’t understand why having free rein to leave the line and meet up with your party at the loading area is not a reasonable choice. We have never used a DAS but my understanding is that you often have a wait, even if it’s just short. When urgency hits - you have very little time to get to a bathroom. It doesn’t matter where in line you are.

I am sympathetic to people who feel like this isn’t feasible. But it seems like instead of trying it some are angry because they feel like they have been disrespected or that their disability is being looked at as not as “bad”. I just think that’s a stretch.

Honestly, this. Ppl seem to be upset because they aren't getting front-of-the-line access anymore. But that isn't a realistic accommodation for ppl with urgent bathroom issues at all, it just makes it more comfortable for their companions. Which is not what the DAS is for imo.

I don't even know if there are like cast member bathrooms they could potential use to accommodate that type of emergency but maybe that would be a better accommodation

 

[TwoMisfits]

That’s every accommodation. All the people with anxiety or autism are theorizing they MAY be overwhelmed in the line. They don’t know for sure. And if we are going to start splitting up parties, then an parent can wait with an Autistic kid outside the line and join the rest of the family (who waited in the line) when they get to the front. That is the same thing people are proposing for people with bathroom problems. I’m tired of people acting like this isn’t as real or as valid as some of these other issues. If they want to decimate the program fine, but don’t single out one disability over another.

I'm almost certain this bathroom pass is the test run to do the same for anxiety sufferers, b/c that is also an area of "what if" that the internet has helped many abusers exploit to the detriment of true sufferers.

 

[redberyl]

I'm almost certain this bathroom pass is the test run to do the same for anxiety sufferers, b/c that is also an area of "what if" that the internet has helped many abusers exploit to the detriment of true sufferers.

My youngest has both bathroom issues and anxiety. Her Bathroom issues can be solved by leaving the line and coming back, but once that anxiety kicks in, she's done with the park for hours, possibly for the whole day. And it's the line itself that triggers the anxiety. She enters the line excited to ride, but the longer she waits the more she catastrophizes . Starts off excited, this ride will be fun, progresses to this ride might be scary, which leads to what if the ride breaks down and I get stuck on this really scary ride, or what if the safety restraint fails and im thrown to my death, and then she's in a full blown anxiety attack which can take hours to recover from. Das helps some but sometimes even waiting in the LL can be too much and she just isn't able to ride it. But anyways her bathroom issues can be dealt with leaving the line for a bit then coming back. Same is not true of her anxiety, at all. So I really don't see how cracking down on bathroom issues can in any way be related to cracking down on people with anxiety. The needs are just too different

 

[GoingSince1990]

If one adult in a party of 6 has trouble waiting in lines due to bathroom or anxiety issues, surely it’s a fair and reasonable accommodation to allow that adult to meet up with the 5 others where the ride boards (perhaps by entering via the ride exit). If it’s a child with the issues, it is reasonable to allow the same accommodation for the child and one adult. Why should the entire party get to avoid the wait in line when only one person has the medical issue?

 

[Evita_W]

They are not violating the ADA. The short answer is that they are required to provide accommodations but not specific accommodations. Even the accommodations they are required to provide are pretty flexible and everything they do today is going above and beyond anything in the ADA.

They aren't allowed to require proof to provide the accommodations under ADA law

 

[Keladry84]

It used to be that wheelchairs could not go through lines and needed an alternate entrance. Disney renovated most all the rides to allow for wheelchairs & ECVs to be accessible - those guests no longer needed an alternate entrance. No longer needed a return time.

When the GAC changed to a DAS, many guests lost their disability pass because their needs were being handled at each attraction based on their needs. They no longer needed the disability pass.……

……..When they first shifted to DAS, narrowing the scope of the use - my interpretation was that the DAS was now for those whose issues were triggered as a direct result of being in the queue space. There are plenty of guests who have reasons why they would like the accommodation, especially since Genie+ is now fee based, but Disney can offer a different accommodation.

This. I think you hit the nail on the head.

The types of disabilities that appear to consistently get approved for the DAS are all ones in which something in the design of the ride queue cause a problem for them to physically access the ride. That person could leave and come back, but no matter what when they hit that same spot in those conditions they will always need to leave again. Although invisible, they are physically barred from advancing through the full queue. The DAS is Disney’s current solution. Similarly they could redesign the queue area (as they did for physical disabilities), or create an alternate physical space for people to wait. Time will see if they pivot to either of these.

The wording for who qualifies for DAS is vague (rightly so as no disability is exactly the same). Many people with a disability that causes them to have problems with a long line or wait time look at the description of the DAS and, correctly, interpret that this could solve their problem. But not all of these in this group are necessarily physically barred by the queue design itself, and with the ability to address their physical need, would be able to proceed through the regular queue line. The first group described here can’t. Leaving and coming back wouldn’t solve the problem.

Disney could, and has in the past, accommodate both groups in the same way (with DAS). The problem is, if too many people are using DAS it no longer accommodates either of the groups, and it also cuts into their profit with Genie plus. At this point in time, there is no other system in place to meet the needs for the first group, as only an accommodation to bypass the main queue works. Thus Disney seems to be looking at other ways to provide an accommodation to address the needs of the second group who can access the physical space of the queue, it just might not be the preferred accommodation.

 

[Evita_W]

This. I think you hit the nail on the head.

The types of disabilities that appear to consistently get approved for the DAS are all ones in which something in the design of the ride queue cause a problem for them to physically access the ride. That person could leave and come back, but no matter what when they hit that same spot in those conditions they will always need to leave again. Although invisible, they are physically barred from advancing through the full queue. The DAS is Disney’s current solution. Similarly they could redesign the queue area (as they did for physical disabilities), or create an alternate physical space for people to wait. Time will see if they pivot to either of these.

The wording for who qualifies for DAS is vague (rightly so as no disability is exactly the same). Many people with a disability that causes them to have problems with a long line or wait time look at the description of the DAS and, correctly, interpret that this could solve their problem. But not all of these in this group are necessarily physically barred by the queue design itself, and with the ability to address their physical need, would be able to proceed through the regular queue line. The first group described here can’t. Leaving and coming back wouldn’t solve the problem.

Disney could, and has in the past, accommodate both groups in the same way (with DAS). The problem is, if too many people are using DAS it no longer accommodates either of the groups, and it also cuts into their profit with Genie plus. At this point in time, there is no other system in place to meet the needs for the first group, as only an accommodation to bypass the main queue works. Thus Disney seems to be looking at other ways to provide an accommodation to address the needs of the second group who can access the physical space of the queue, it just might not be the preferred accommodation.

Which as I said, I have no issue with, there just need to be some tweaks for those with mobility devices on top of bathroom issues. And it may not be an issue with all queue designs, so it may need to be attraction specific, just needs to be thought about more than it is currently.

Because as you rightfully point out, if there are too many DAS users, it doesn't accommodate anyone's needs.

As I said, for DH there are other needs as well, but understands the issues for some.

That being said, if there were more attractions with Genie+ and you could repeat attractions, we would likely just buy Genie+ to avoid the issues. We used to do that with MaxPass and it was great. The problem is we don't do every attraction, even if they just said it was valid for x number of attractions, it would do the trick, even better if it would work on any attraction.

 

[PatMcDuck]

My adult non verbal son (autism and Down syndrome, uses a chair at parks) has been granted DAS for bathroom issues in the past, we go to DL in 5 weeks and will see what happens. His issue is too gross to describe here, and he is fine at home, only has problems on his Disney trips. Will report back if this thread is still open. I probably won't bother to try to register in advance this time. (we usually buy Genie+ so that helps too).