Do You Consider Yourself a Feminist?

[AppleDumpling]

Haven’t read the entire thread, but yes, of course I am a feminist. I don’t understand why people seem to be threatened by that word. To me, it simply means I support women’s rights as a subset of basic human rights. And it extends beyond the US, to many parts of the world, in societies where women and girls are treated poorly as second class citizens.

While the focus is primarily on legal, political and cultural issues, much like racism, there are systemic biases against women that should also be addressed. This includes product design that affects our everyday lives and may negatively impact our health and safety. A couple of interesting articles on the subject:

https://medium.com/hh-design/the-world-is-designed-for-men-d06640654491

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/feb/23/truth-world-built-for-men-car-crashes

 

[shelemm]

Haven’t read the entire thread, but yes, of course I am a feminist. I don’t understand why people seem to be threatened by that word.

Ignorance of history and lack of empathy.

 

[ScottOKW2K]

It was made GLARINGLY obvious to me when I sat on a recent meeting of the joint elected leaders of my city and neighboring township. 10 people. 1 woman. Me. That's it. Pretty damn sad. More than 1/2 the residents of both of those areas are female. Yet, ONE woman's voice is heard in matters affecting us all. This should not be in the year 2019 in America. Pathetic.

One question - how many women actually ran for office for those elected leader positions? If you had twenty or thirty people running for those offices in the last election, and only a few were female then the likely result was few (or no) females getting elected. I don't pretend to know the details - I am assuming at least two persons running for each position. And since the elected officials in office are in a area that is more than 50% female - maybe that's what the voters wanted, both female and male.

Their bodies, their vote, their choice.

 

[Poohforyou]

Yes, I believe in equality for everyone regardless of gender, race, religion, sexual orientation, etc. Feminism is simply equality for women.

 

[Colleen27]

I used to waffle on this, not because of the dictionary definition of the term but because of how I perceived those who embraced it enthusiastically. Now, after having raised a girl almost to adulthood with another just hitting the difficult tween/teen years? I'm one of those women that used to give me pause about embracing the label. It is funny how that happened... For myself, I never really cared for social norms and tended to be pretty "in my own world" to the point of being oblivious to certain pressures (though I certainly thought my workplace in need of a few feminists when, in my first tech job, a gendered dress code had me required to wear skirts even though my job sometimes involved climbing ladders and crawling under desks!) But in guiding my girls, I see it so much more clearly.

It isn't generally blatant discrimination, though that does still exist in some corners of the world (and workforce), or rights that they don't have, though it is certainly trending in that direction (bodily autonomy being a rather fundamental right by any standard). It is more about how gender shapes the experience of growing up and living in America, how girls are discouraged from pursuing certain kinds of ambitions on the grounds that their goals aren't compatible with their eventual motherhood, how fearful they are expected to be in interacting with the world in the name of protecting themselves, how they're taken less seriously in important matters like professional accomplishment and medical treatment, etc. We may have equal rights, on paper at least, but we are still a long way from equality. If two people have equal legal right to apply for a job, but the employer won't even bother scheduling interviews for applications with female-sounding names, is that really equality? If two people go to a doctor with the same complaint, and the man's self-assessment is taken seriously and referred for follow up while the woman's self-assessment is dismissed with a wait-and-see view, is that really equality? If a man can confidently work late, take travel assignments, and aggressively pursue his chosen career while a woman holds back amid the litany of what-ifs about dark parking lots and traveling alone that she's heard since birth, is that really equality?

 

[mnrose]

One question - how many women actually ran for office for those elected leader positions? If you had twenty or thirty people running for those offices in the last election, and only a few were female then the likely result was few (or no) females getting elected. I don't pretend to know the details - I am assuming at least two persons running for each position. And since the elected officials in office are in a area that is more than 50% female - maybe that's what the voters wanted, both female and male.

Their bodies, their vote, their choice.

See, it's WAY deeper than that. Why do women not run? What are we told our entire lives that makes women believe they CAN'T or shouldn't run? Why do (presumptively) so many, many men run and women not? It's very systemic.

It was scary as hell for me to put myself out there and run. My ENTIRE life I've seen predominantly (overwhelmingly) male leadership. "Leader" and "man" are the same in lots of people's minds because that is what they've seen. I'm a smart, thoughtful, knowledgeable person, and yet, I still had an internal dialogue going on that said "don't do it." And, if *I* had that dialogue, how scary must it be for women who don't come with the same credentials? Yet, the MEN who are on these councils are no where NEAR as qualified by background and training. Not even close. They have no qualms about running. I want a world where women believe they are entitled to a seat at the table when decisions are being made that affect them. And, for that to happen, we've got to create role models for them. It's why I ran. If not me, who?

I want a world where we no longer need to "count" how many women are CEO's or Presidents or Senators because it will be a non-issue. It clearly has not happened yet. Not even close. When will there be enough women on the Supreme Court? When there are more. That's when. We had 9 men for two hundred years+. Now we've got a couple women and people want to say "oh that's enough now." BS. Women have been WAY more than 1/2 of law school graduates since I was in law school, a long time ago. Yet, we are no where close to 1/2 the jurists. Sigh.

 

[Colleen27]

No, self-proclaimed Feminists seem to claim they want equal rights, but in practice they seem to seek to put down men. No one ever brought himself (or herself) up by putting down others.

Sure they did. We're in a country that literally built itself up on the subjugation and elimination of the native inhabitants and on the forced labor of people imported for that express purpose, and it is only very recently in our history that women have been allowed to compete with men educationally and professionally. A whole lot of people throughout a whole lot of our history brought themselves up by putting down and stepping on others.

And a lot of what is condemned as "putting down" men is simply asking them to address the ways they contribute to ongoing inequities, or stand quietly by and benefit from their advantaged status because they accept it as "just the way it is" or as something to be actively protected.

"people do not appear to reject the term feminism because they are against gender equality or believe it has been achieved. (As has been said many times in this thread.)

It could be that they do not feel the term speaks to them."

I'll add that some of the antics of those representing "feminism" in the past few years have been a turn off to many.

But hasn't that always been the way? My mom talks about being horrified when my aunt declared herself a feminist, when they were teens in the mid-1960s, because to her, feminists were bra-burning, man-hating militants who didn't shave their legs. But was that ever a fair characterization of feminism as a whole, or was it just the most shocking, media-friendly image that reporters and politicians used to paint the whole idea as "out there" and extreme?

I want to like your post, as in how you stated it. I am, however, horrified because it is so dead on. As someone whos in-laws asked her, "what did you do to kill this one" after my third miscarriage, I fear what is in store for those women who have a miscarriage.

That's my fear too... how many women are going to face potential prosecution for miscarriage? How many will avoid seeking medical treatment for miscarriage out of that worry? It isn't likely that anyone will start investigating middle class women to see if they had sushi or changed the catbox after finding out they were pregnant, but it doesn't feel like a stretch at all to start demanding drug testing of women seeking care for a miscarriage and prosecuting those who test positive as having caused/contributed to the loss of the pregnancy.

 

[kaytieeldr]

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/man-hating-goes-mainstream/

Magazine's description of itself: "COMMENTARY is America's premier monthly magazine of opinion and a pivotal voice in American intellectual life. "

http://www.womensmediacenter.com/ne...arged-with-inciting-hatred-against-men-online

Mmm, maybe not the best example "...just one example of how the Kremlin is using anti-extremism legislation to crack down on political dissent, according to human rights groups and activists familiar with the issue."

 

[cabanafrau]

2. A man who fathers a child outside of wedlock can be forced to pay child support for the child -- even if he doesn't want the child or wishes the mother to have an abortion. Once the child is conceived, the woman can make the choices, and the state will force the man to comply.

If history has shown us anything it's definitely proven that when parents of children will not cooperate with one another regarding care, custody and support of their children it's to be expected it will be the man left shouldering the burden 99.99% of the time. In a book of fairy tales.

We live in an era where at long last more women have access to some parity regarding parental responsibilities, yet it's still true that when parents do not cooperate with one another regarding care, custody and support of their children that many more women than men are the ones shouldering the lion's share of the burden.

Thank goodness most fathers are loving, caring, concerned and involved parents.

 

[Moliphino]

Just the way that male bodies are seen as the default and everything (seatbelts, PPE, phones, etc) is designed for that default human body makes the world more dangerous for women.

It's a kind of long article, but I found it fascinating.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/feb/23/truth-world-built-for-men-car-crashes

 

[kaytieeldr]

That does not list any rights that women are being denied. That article just references the fact that an overarching ERA has not been passed to guarantee equality. That doesn't mean that we are being denied rights.

https://www.equalrightsamendment.org/faq

 

[kaytieeldr]

and the state will force the man to comply.

Including, and notably, states which have recently passed laws forcing women to carry the baby to term.

 

[kaytieeldr]

FTR, laws don't have to make things better for one gender over the other if that is what you meant by the bolded

Equal. Not better. Just equal.

 

[AppleDumpling]

Just the way that male bodies are seen as the default and everything (seatbelts, PPE, phones, etc) is designed for that default human body makes the world more dangerous for women.

It's a kind of long article, but I found it fascinating.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/feb/23/truth-world-built-for-men-car-crashes

I posted the same article and another one about this a few posts back. I agree it’s fascinating, but also frustrating and really inexcusable when you consider that women outnumber men in population. And it’s something most people never really think about, unless it’s pointed out.

It’s always annoyed me as a petite woman, that seat belts in cars don’t fit well and often cut across my neck. And other stupid things about car design like the lack of a place to put a purse.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Watching the news and they just said a woman will be going to the moon.

Fifty-five years after the first men went. But, um, why? What's changed on the moon? Why not send a crew (of only women!) to Mars?

 

[luvsJack]

I am to an extent. Of course I believe that women should have the same rights as a man. I believe in equal pay for equal work.

But, around here, I don't see this inequality that some of you seem to see. My supervisor is a woman, her supervisor is a woman and the VP of the campus is a woman. A woman that rose from first year instructor to campus VP in 10 years. Other male VPs took much longer to get there. Her mother was an elected person of power and was great at what she did. She is still a very strong and influential woman. My mother and my grandmother were business owners in their own right. Their husbands were also but Mom and Grandma owned successful businesses of their own.

Maybe its just the people around me, I don't know but I haven't seen any glass ceilings for women. I do not believe that women in the US are oppressed.

As women, though, we should be looking worldwide for how women are treated in other countries. I mean, here we are talking about seat belts and where to put a purse, they can't drive a car or go to school or have a job. They are seen as property, owned by their husbands. Yeah, I think US women have it pretty good.

 

[Moliphino]

I posted the same article and another one about this a few posts back. I agree it’s fascinating, but also frustrating and really inexcusable when you consider that women outnumber men in population. And it’s something most people never really think about, unless it’s pointed out.

It’s always annoyed me as a petite woman, that seat belts in cars don’t fit well and often cut across my neck. And other stupid things about car design like the lack of a place to put a purse.

Oops, sorry! It's totally worth bringing up time and again.

As women, though, we should be looking worldwide for how women are treated in other countries. I mean, here we are talking about seat belts and where to put a purse, they can't drive a car or go to school or have a job. They are seen as property, owned by their husbands. Yeah, I think US women have it pretty good.

Feminism isn't limited to the US. Feminists are also working to get/keep girls in school throughout the world, improve period related health and access to products (as well as trying to remove the stigma associated with periods in some areas), and any number of other things to improve women's lives throughout the world. But there is still work that needs to be done here, too.

 

[AppleDumpling]

As women, though, we should be looking worldwide for how women are treated in other countries. I mean, here we are talking about seat belts and where to put a purse, they can't drive a car or go to school or have a job. They are seen as property, owned by their husbands. Yeah, I think US women have it pretty good.

I totally agree with you, but it is all relative. Yes, American women are much better off than women in many other countries; I think we can all acknowledge that. We have many freedoms that others do not and that is incredibly sad. However, we still have a long way to go to achieve full equality, or to use the more accurate term, equitability (because, due to inherent differences between the sexes, in some ways it is not possible to have true equality).

The discussion of seat belts and purses was just an example of systemic discrimination we all face. And sorry, but I think seat belts are quite important, since they could potentially contribute to my death.

 

[amberpi]

It’s always annoyed me as a petite woman, that seat belts in cars don’t fit well and often cut across my neck. And other stupid things about car design like the lack of a place to put a purse.

Off Topic, but:

Preach! Also, why are medications only sold in children and adult sizes? So happy I finally have a doc who changes my dosages from the pre-paid medication into something more appropriate for my size. Meds still make me even weirder than I am, but it's better.

 

[AppleDumpling]

Feminism isn't limited to the US. Feminists are also working to get/keep girls in school throughout the world, improve period related health and access to products (as well as trying to remove the stigma associated with periods in some areas), and any number of other things to improve women's lives throughout the world. But there is still work that needs to be done here, too.

Absolutely. When I hear about women around the world who are subjugated, oppressed, and abused, in awful and inhuman ways, it makes me sick. The women in burqas, the ones who have no voice, the girls who are denied a basic education, the girls forced to be child brides, the ones who are brutally raped or beaten, those who suffer through genital mutilation, the victims of honor killings, etc. All the more reason to be a feminist! Anyone who cares about compassion and human dignity should be. Including men.