How Strict Are You With Social Distancing?

[FairestOfThemAll37]

So ... you’re demanding that these various businesses open up and serve you regardless of the potential consequences to the employees or other patrons of those businesses. In other words, those employees are expendable, because as you‘ve said, the herd is going to be culled no matter what. You really don’t care who gets sick, or who gets complications, or who dies ... the most important thing is that these places open up pronto and serve YOU. As long as you’re taken care of, no one else really matters do they?

You’re the second person to make a comment about “demanding” business open up. Where has that happened? I’m only awar of businesses being allowed to re-open. Many salons, retail stores, and restaurants have chosen to remain closed (or have already gone out of business from the shut down) despite being able to open.

I don’t think it’s legal to force a business to operate. If a business chooses to open as allowed by the state, why shouldn’t people patronize it if they feel comfortable doing so? Are we to assume nobody wants to risk going back to work and they need to be protected by not using and business or services? Until when? If businesses stay closed or have no customers they’ll have to close permanently. There’s not enough money to keep everybody in business (Unemployment will go bankrupt as well unless the Fed just keeps printing more money) for the next 6 months or years.

The idea of waiting until “it’s safer” is really nebulous. When states show steady numbers despite reopening people cry foul and say the numbers are a conspiracy.

There are certainly people out there acting like fools IMO and not following guidelines, but there’s definitely the other extreme where a group is fighting to keep anything from opening (or if open, shaming people for using the services).

This shift of keeping hospitals from being overrun to everybody staying in until this thing burns out or there’s a cure is really scary. I know it’s the source of a lot of conflict on the internet and it’s becoming apparent in real life as more and more opens. That’s clear just from this thread. Multiple people have commented on how selfish it is to go get a haircut or do anything not necessary for basic survival.

Even the medical experts have said we can’t keep the lockdown going indefinitely.

 

[disneychrista]

You’re the second person to make a comment about “demanding” business open up. Where has that happened?

You have not had protests with people holding up "Open Up Now" signs? This is people demanding the business be open.

 

[Christine]

You have not had protests with people holding up "Open Up Now" signs? This is people demanding the business be open.

We've had many protests at our state capital building because people are just pissed that the governor wouldn't go into phase 1. Lots of grumblings about trampling their rights and *wanting* to wreck the economy. I do think that much of this pressure (protests and extremely awful social media posts) have forced some governors to open rather that worry that it's going to boil over.

 

[kdonnel]

You have not had protests with people holding up "Open Up Now" signs? This is people demanding the business be open.

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Those are poorly worded signs. Those are people demanding that the businesses be allowed to reopen.

 

[AnnTiquity]

I'm social distancing more now than during the lockdown here in Texas. I frequently encounter hostility when I am wearing a mask lately. Therefore I hereby bequeath the whole state of Texas to the folks who think that everything is back to normal. Also my share of the economy. I will get grocery delivery once a week and walk to the donut shop twice a week. That is my plan for the summer. It will save me a lot of money. I will go back to working in the office when I must but otherwise I'll be staying home. My motto is "If I can't eat it I don't need it". Just because stores are open doesn't mean I have to shop.

 

[ronandannette]

You have not had protests with people holding up "Open Up Now" signs? This is people demanding the business be open.

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Those protesters are "demanding" authorities allow businesses to reopen, not "demanding" the individual businesses actually do so. And there's no way you don't know that. It doesn't illustrate your point at all.

 

[mjkacmom]

https://patch.com/new-jersey/manala...ook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=blasts

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

You have not had protests with people holding up "Open Up Now" signs? This is people demanding the business be open.

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I think if I was demanding a particular place to be open I'd protest in front of said place (like a particular bar or salon.

Largely I think it was about businesses (both owners and patrons) wanting the choice rather than being mandated to close and if still operating facing fines and jail/criminal action. And at least some places around the U.S. focused on action towards businesses not necessarily the people (my area included).

I heard from way too many business owners not to be believe that it was some one-sided whiny "people just wanting a dang haircut". It is an easy narrative though to latch onto (not saying you personally just what tends to get thrown out there).

 

[Kitty 34]

We've had many protests at our state capital building because people are just pissed that the governor wouldn't go into phase 1. Lots of grumblings about trampling their rights and *wanting* to wreck the economy. I do think that much of this pressure (protests and extremely awful social media posts) have forced some governors to open rather that worry that it's going to boil over.

I have to admit, Christine....I checked to see if you were from Michigan.

 

[disneychrista]

Those are poorly worded signs. Those are people demanding that the businesses be allowed to reopen.

You looked way closer at those then I did. I only see "Open Cali Now" and Open Our Bars"

Those protesters are "demanding" authorities allow businesses to reopen, not "demanding" the individual businesses actually do so. And there's no way you don't know that. It doesn't illustrate your point at all.

Exactly. People who may or may not have anything to do with a small business are DEMANDING that they be open. I will agree that no particular business is being forced to open. But workers of the businesses that do are (in effect) being forced to go back to work.

 

[texaslover]

Sorry but that is a BS answer. When you demand that restaurants, bars, etc open and those in power give in you taking the choice away. Under normal circumstances she LOVES her job but not when faced with a potentially deadly pandemic.

Do you feel the same way about teachers? So many people are demanding that schools reopen in their regular format because children are not being properly educated and they are worried about their emotional well being. If this can happen and teachers will have to decide to almost certainly be exposed at some point isn't it the same thing? Yes I have a choice to quit my job but I have to pay the mortgage so that choice comes with too big of a price. I'm not talking about you specifically but it seems like most people who argue about wearing masks at all times/everywhere or that anything that is "non-essential" should stay closed don't feel the same about schools.

 

[kdonnel]

You looked way closer at those then I did. I only see "Open Cali Now" and Open Our Bars"

I based my opinion solely on Open Our Bars. I see no demand to force a particular business to open, Unless there is a chain of "Our Bars" in that state.

 

[BlueStarryHat]

For what it's worth, we had to have a technician from DirectTV come over to the house to fix the service because they were unable to do it remotely. He was masked up, and so were we. When he left, we wiped down everything he touched. Better safe than sorry.

 

[disneychrista]

I'm not talking about you specifically but it seems like most people who argue about wearing masks at all times/everywhere or that anything that is "non-essential" should stay closed don't feel the same about schools.

I DON'T (personally) feel that all non-essential business should be closed. I wasn't arguing that point at all. In fact I have issue with labling some stores essential but other non-essential. I am of the camp that if Walmart, Home Depot & the grocery store can be "safely" open with restrictions there is no reason for all stores not to be open with similar restrictions. That does not mean that I will be visiting those stores but that is a personal choice.

Edited to add: I do feel that business with close person to person contact (salons, barbershops & similar), prolonged contact (bars, in dining restaurants, gyms, etc), gatherings (fairs, festivals, theme parks, concerts, etc) should still be closed. But I do not make those decisions, so I will just not partake in these things.

I honestly do not know how I feel about schools. My children are adults, I do not have enough information of how things are being handled now.

 

[EveDallas]

So you think there's a statewide conspiracy in Texas? Do know how big Texas is and how hard it would be to convince the huge number of medical professionals to go along with the conspiracy to hide corona deaths? We're 35 times the size of New Jersey with 3x the number of people. That's a pretty big area that consists of a lot of people in the medical community that would have to buy into a cover up.

In any case, you won't have to wait long to see the results. Most things here in Texas are pretty much back to normal except for reduced capacity in restaurants and stuff. If your suspicions are right then there should be a huge spike in cases and deaths very soon. If it doesn't materialize then your conspiracy theory is dead in the water.

Also I'll add that I'm just north of Dallas in an area of about 100k people and I would estimate that maybe 10-20% wear masks while the vast majority does not. In the county I'm in we have about 1.9 confirmed cases per 1k people. I'm sure the actually number is much, much higher but since the vast majority of people show little to no symptoms, unless there is mass antibody testing nobody will really know the actual numbers, they're nothing but guesses.

I'm just east of Dallas and yes, things are looking much more normal here. Some people in this area are still wearing masks in stores but I'd say 30 - 40% don't anymore. I haven't seen a mask on anyone outside at all lately. I know the second I walk out of the doors at work my paper mask comes off and goes straight into the dumpster.

 

[EveDallas]

It's a fact that EVERY state is underreporting cases, because there's no way to count them since the majority have little to no symptoms. Except in small cases only the sickest of the sick who seek medical attention are being tested.

I seriously doubt that any state is underreporting deaths, other than possibly in the beginning when there was limited testing, because even when covid may just be a contributing factor to an underlying condition, it's still being reported as the cause of death. My sister is director at a large hospital here so I get a lot of direct information and in our area of 136k people we've had one confirmed death. While the actual cause of death was a heart attack they listed covid as the cause because he was sick.

But like I said, if you believe the underreporting is true then you'll find out for sure soon enough because as we open up there will be a huge increase in cases that will be impossible to hide.

And at least in Dallas County, we have some political officials that would be chomping at the bit to report a major spike in cases so they could say "See, I told you we should stay closed."

 

[bavaria]

Well, we can look at Germany for what our response could have looked like. Or rather, what our response absolutely *should* have looked like. Being the Greatest most Successful Nation since the dawn of man...and all.

Like Germany, for one, we should have a national response. We didn't have that. We still don't have that. We should have locked down sooner. We should have had enough PPE in place. We should have been testing like crazy, and we should have had a plan in place from the second we locked down....about how we would have opened back up. Germany has a population that is 25% of ours....80 million people. Yet they've had just 10% of the amount of cases when compared to the United States. And just 8% the number of deaths when compared with us. Their leaders stood together and did not blame everyone and everything else. It was a coordinated national response led by a woman, who also happens to be a scientist. That's about as good as it gets for a large Western nation.

For some perspective, I went shopping on the 18th of March and Rossmann had a sale on TP and there was product in stock, and Rewe had fully stocked shelves. Despite cases in Bavaria early in the year, there was not really a full closing until mid-March, after Merkel made her speech on 18th March. States have been opening up progressively for several weeks and R0 continues to be at good levels, new cases continue to drop, deaths continue to drop. Kitas and schools are returning progressively, following the Danish model which has not resulted in an increase in cases. Also note that while there was a strong Federal response, a few weeks ago the states overran Mutti's timeline against her wishes, and still there is a good outcome to date.

Now even the very conservative Drosten says that there may not be a second wave, and to follow the Japan model. (Apologies not sure if this article says all what I read in a German one) https://www.spiegel.de/internationa...asures-a-39a8ea77-ec87-4b34-9996-c94ff07c5659

The Merkel/Drosten combination of two scientists making the decisions I think was a primary reason for success, along with a health care system which has one of the highest rates of ICU beds. And when it came time to consider reopening, Merkel actually told Drosten that while she values his input and advice, she has to balance science with running a country, and would open against his advice. Now he has moderated his stance as we learn more, and things are sounding much more hopeful.

This week in Berlin gyms can open (but sadly not yet sauna and indoor pools), along with pubs and bars. Meetings of 150 people can be held, and from 300 end of the month. Museums opened early in May, and EuropaPark last week. Outdoor pools have been open in most states already.

Regarding leadership, Merkel has given some very effective speeches, notably 18th March when things were shutting down, and one to prepare for Easter. I have not been a Merkel fan in past, but in this instance and in one other I have been proud to be a German, and to have her leading us and Europe through crisis.

And on a final note, she is the first G7 leader to politely decline the invitation from Trump to travel to the US for a G7 summit
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020...-invite-person-g7-summit-200530073819446.html

 

[Colleen27]

It doesn't work that way. I can no more demand someone show up for work or work at a specific place than they can demand that I stay home. The waitress has just as much choice to work at the bar or not to work at the bar.

But you can demand that they choose between returning to work in a high-risk situation and financial ruin. To say that isn't a demand is just splitting hairs.

Those protesters are "demanding" authorities allow businesses to reopen, not "demanding" the individual businesses actually do so. And there's no way you don't know that. It doesn't illustrate your point at all.

As is this... There is little practical difference between demanding businesses reopen and demanding businesses, most of whom are owned by people who can decide to reopen with little to no risk to themselves personally, be "allowed" to reopen. Yes, some businesses - mostly those where the owners and/or their own family members work in a hands-on capacity - are choosing to remain closed. But far more are open because the people who own the store can sit safely at home and decide that their employees must put themselves at risk.

 

[TLSnell1981]

It looks like many of our largest cities have already opened with no social distancing. Not really sure how that's going to turn out. Guess we will find out soon.

 

[wildride]

And so...

So much for temp checks.