Is Universal's Epic Universe a Shot Across the Bow or A Body Blow to Disney

[maverik85]

From what I've heard, it was J.K. Rowling that turned down Disney versus the other way around. Disney refused to give her creative control so she went down the street where Universal was more than happy to do it. I can only imagine that Disney couldn't imagine the eventual gold mine the Wizarding World would be.

That's why I think it's kind of a mix. Disney didn't directly pass on HP, Rowling turned them down. But it was Disney's unwillingness to work with her or relinquish any control, as well as severely underutilizing the property to its fullest with just a very small land with a ride and QS eatery, that made her pass on them and go to Universal.
Overall I am happy about that though. Disney has plenty of their own IPs and original concepts to build whatever they want. Plus HP gave Universal the big push for them to truly become the competitor in the market that they are now. On top of that the immersion and detail that went into the HP plans has set a new standard for parks to try to attain.
This competition has only benefitted us park goers as it has pushed Disney to really grow. Their parks have always been great but have overall sat unchanged for awhile. Once HP hit they started to develop more and the more universal does the more Disney has pushed forward with new rides and concepts. Plus I'm sure the immersive lands they are building with more detail like GE and Pandora are directly related to response the HP lands received from guest for their immersion.
So overall I don't think Disney is too concerned about struggling as they will always be popular and one of the premier destinations, but Universal has pushed them to do more to try to keep guests on property longer and coming back more often. Universal might not be completely stealing their guests but they are stealing some of the time that they would be staying on and spending money at Disney's property.

 

[kbelle8995]

I think that they are making an effort to keep Universal on being a destination for guests to the state. They are currently meeting Disney on Hotels. Cabana Bay is a better value and nicer hotel than any value Disney has to offer. The potter areas especially Diagon Alley is one my favorite areas. Plus I don't have to mega plan to go to Universal. I got an annual pass for Disney this year but only so I could experience Star Wars.

 

[RamblingMad]

That's why I think it's kind of a mix. Disney didn't directly pass on HP, Rowling turned them down. But it was Disney's unwillingness to work with her or relinquish any control, as well as severely underutilizing the property to its fullest with just a very small land with a ride and QS eatery, that made her pass on them and go to Universal.
Overall I am happy about that though. Disney has plenty of their own IPs and original concepts to build whatever they want. Plus HP gave Universal the big push for them to truly become the competitor in the market that they are now. On top of that the immersion and detail that went into the HP plans has set a new standard for parks to try to attain.
This competition has only benefitted us park goers as it has pushed Disney to really grow. Their parks have always been great but have overall sat unchanged for awhile. Once HP hit they started to develop more and the more universal does the more Disney has pushed forward with new rides and concepts. Plus I'm sure the immersive lands they are building with more detail like GE and Pandora are directly related to response the HP lands received from guest for their immersion.
So overall I don't think Disney is too concerned about struggling as they will always be popular and one of the premier destinations, but Universal has pushed them to do more to try to keep guests on property longer and coming back more often. Universal might not be completely stealing their guests but they are stealing some of the time that they would be staying on and spending money at Disney's property.

WDW is a planning nightmare, so I’ve given up on Disney in FL. It wasn’t this way when I was a kid. It wasn’t this way in my 20s. I just don’t see the point. And the resort prices are ridiculous.

So if I want to go on Disney rides, I’ll go to CA. I will only go to Universal in FL. I haven’t been back to Sea World since Blackfish, and I haven’t been back to Disney in five years.

And I just spent an extended weekend at Universal last minute. It was great. No crazy planning. I just showed up and rode rides.

 

[glamdring269]

I’m not even clear on what people are talking about when they reference the ‘feeling’ of Disney. I get it at MK and to some extent Epcot. But AK and DHS?

We still go to WDW and I definitely don’t look forward to the planning we have to do just to make it tolerable (our FP window opens tomorrow for example). On the flip side, I know that by staying on site at Universal that it’s going to be a nice and relaxing way to end our week thanks to EP. HP land is the best themed area I’ve ever experienced as well and provides a lot more ‘magic’ for us now relative to most anything offered at WDW at this point.

You can tell Disney is trying though. Star Wars will drive people in but I don’t think it’s going to be as well received as HP. Will be able to form my own opinion in about 62 days.

Anyway, with all of this said, Universal seems to be on their game in terms of more modern wants so I fully expect this park to be a shot across the bow (at minimum).

 

[Disxuni]

It was JK that passed on Disney and went to Universal, not Disney passing on Potter.

Their imagineers couldn't get it right after several design tries and she broke things off with Disney in frustration.

A lot of people don't realize that Disney didn't pass Potter in the theme parks entirely it's the fact that anything they offered JK was a very lazy effort, an unimaginative effort. Also, they missed their chance in other areas multiple times as well. When I looked more into it and looked up the history of what happened awhile back, I was shocked at what Disney had either not offered, or eventually offered and considering their innovative reputation I was shocked at how disappointed I was in them. Yesterworld has a good video on the history of it all.

As I said previously, the issue with Disney is that I feel as if they do not need to try anymore. Then with the select projects they do try their hardest on and manage to be successful seem to take forever to construct. For a few examples: FoP was amazing, TSL has great theming, but 2 out of 3 out of the new rides are unimaginative (kind of argue that for SDD too, but is great, fun ride to those who rode it), GE I cannot judge (but I've seen mixed reviews), and Tron is not coming out until 2021.

The thing about the theme park is it's reputation and it also goes back to first impressions. Disney started at such a high level and due to that, it's hard to complete with itself in the future, especially if they select and choose on what they really want to aim high for and not. It doesn't help that they're focusing on spending billions on purchasing another company rather than investing it into the parks.

Universal on the other hand, while it's great, was never considered at the same caliber as Disney in the past and at this point, keeps increasingly getting better and better and trying to outdo itself with each major project (for the most part *coughfastandfuriouscough*).

Will Universal ever pass Disney, or crush the competition with them? Eh, I don't know. But are they working harder, or being more imaginative? I kind of think they are.

 

[glamdring269]

In reference to Tron, I've always loved the original and think the new one is okay. But who is that intended to drive to the parks that wouldn't have come otherwise? To me that is the difference between the two at this point. Granted Star Wars is an IP that will certainly drive people to the parks but I'm not convinced those people wouldn't have come to DW/DL at some point regardless.

 

[CPanther95]

I’m not even clear on what people are talking about when they reference the ‘feeling’ of Disney. I get it at MK and to some extent Epcot. But AK and DHS?

We still go to WDW and I definitely don’t look forward to the planning we have to do just to make it tolerable (our FP window opens tomorrow for example). On the flip side, I know that by staying on site at Universal that it’s going to be a nice and relaxing way to end our week thanks to EP. HP land is the best themed area I’ve ever experienced as well and provides a lot more ‘magic’ for us now relative to most anything offered at WDW at this point.

You can tell Disney is trying though. Star Wars will drive people in but I don’t think it’s going to be as well received as HP. Will be able to form my own opinion in about 62 days.

Anyway, with all of this said, Universal seems to be on their game in terms of more modern wants so I fully expect this park to be a shot across the bow (at minimum).

The only special feeling you get at Disney is the nostalgia if you went as a kid. I went throughout the 70's so I really looked forward to when I could take my kids. But it wasn't a pleasant vacation spot in the 90's and by most accounts it's far worse now. We switched over to Universal when my kids were young - and one of the primary reasons was I didn't want them to be a slave to that nostalgia when they had kids of their own.

Now my kids go to Universal, have a relaxing vacation with their kids, and they get the nostalgia at Universal that I once had at Disney. I broke the cycle - and my kids have saved a ton of money and time because of it.

 

[skylock]

The only special feeling you get at Disney is the nostalgia if you went as a kid. I went throughout the 70's so I really looked forward to when I could take my kids. But it wasn't a pleasant vacation spot in the 90's and by most accounts it's far worse now. We switched over to Universal when my kids were young - and one of the primary reasons was I didn't want them to be a slave to that nostalgia when they had kids of their own.

Now my kids go to Universal, have a relaxing vacation with their kids, and they get the nostalgia at Universal that I once had at Disney. I broke the cycle - and my kids have saved a ton of money and time because of it.

Actually for me, I still love disney. It was actually started getting painful at the changes I was seeing. I grew up watching disney every sunday night and I wanted to go so bad as a child, but that didn't happen. I started going when my son was 5. He is 37 now.

When we first went, that place was **** and span clean. Everything freshly painted, everything maintained to the top of perfection.

In the llast few years I went, there was garbage piled up everywhere. Chipped and pealing paint. A lack luster attitude from the cast members. Almost no help if you had a problem. Absolutely nothing like the early days.

Once in the early days, my niece developed a nose bleed just as we were headed to the countries in epcot. I ran to the nearest restaurant to get napkins and when I got back there were castmembers there with ice, a wet rag and were escorting her to a place to sit down. They offered to take her to firstaid to lay down. We said no to all those offers because it was a common problem she had so we went on. Hours later we were stopped by a man in a suit that just said he wanted to check everything was still going ok. How did he know who we were and how did he find us? Tip top customer service in our minds.

So, the last year I went we were sitting behind the castle discussing that pile of trash over there behind the trash can was the same trash that was there the night before just more of it when a mouse ran up my nieces pants leg (a different niece) causing her to jump back and scraping her leg on those bricks quite badly. As in bleeding into her shoe. We stopped several cast members that agreed that was nasty. We made our way to first aid, could not get anyones attention and wound up washing her leg off in the bathroom and leaving the park to go to walgreens for supplies.

That was my last straw and I have not been back again, but, I still miss it. Less and less every year, but still.

 

[Disxuni]

So, the last year I went we were sitting behind the castle discussing that pile of trash over there behind the trash can was the same trash that was there the night before just more of it when a mouse ran up my nieces pants leg (a different niece) causing her to jump back and scraping her leg on those bricks quite badly. As in bleeding into her shoe. We stopped several cast members that agreed that was nasty. We made our way to first aid, could not get anyones attention and wound up washing her leg off in the bathroom and leaving the park to go to walgreens for supplies.

That was my last straw and I have not been back again, but, I still miss it. Less and less every year, but still.

I'm surprised by that considering how many people didn't really do anything to help. Did they not help very well, or not have good supplies at First Aid? I don't mean to be nosy, I just asked, since you said you were heading there, but then said you washed her up in a bathroom and left the park for Walgreens.

As for the trash, I know that's one of my best friend's mother's complaints is the trash and how ill kept the parks seem to be in comparison to when she was growing up, as well as the CMs as well. However, CMs are a hit and miss at the parks. As for example, when I got sick and went to the bathroom, my father thought I was going to pass out due to how red my face was, he told a CM, and they called an ambulance. I refused to go (wanted me to go due to high blood pressure and high heart rate), but gave me as much water as needed, gave me a wheel chair to sit in while the EMTs checked me, and from the bus area drove us directly to our car.

 

[skylock]

I'm surprised by that considering how many people didn't really do anything to help. Did they not help very well, or not have good supplies at First Aid? I don't mean to be nosy, I just asked, since you said you were heading there, but then said you washed her up in a bathroom and left the park for Walgreens.

As for the trash, I know that's one of my best friend's mother's complaints is the trash and how ill kept the parks seem to be in comparison to when she was growing up, as well as the CMs as well. However, CMs are a hit and miss at the parks. As for example, when I got sick and went to the bathroom, my father thought I was going to pass out due to how red my face was, he told a CM, and they called an ambulance. I refused to go (wanted me to go due to high blood pressure and high heart rate), but gave me as much water as needed, gave me a wheel chair to sit in while the EMTs checked me, and from the bus area drove us directly to our car.

The experience you describe is something along the lines of what I would expect, but apparently blood streaming down a leg is not that important any more. We were told we could go to first aid which is where we were headed anyway. But nothing else was done except agree it needed to be looked at.

There was no offer of a wet towel, no offer of a wheelchair. Nothing but we could go to first aid.

It seriously was not that bad, but when it is a 19 year old girl, well you know. First the mouse, which was no longer a big deal after she saw the blood. Nothing that would require stitches, it was just a bad scraped leg, but the absolute could not care less attitude was beyond what I expected esp with previous positive exp.

When we got to first aid, there were several people already there. No medical people were in sight. I asked the people waiting how long they had been waiting, several had been there for a while. So we just left. I am a registered nurse so I knew I could take care of it, I just didn't have anything to take care of it with.

I so much wanted to go back the next day to see if her skin was still stuck to those bricks and see if the blood drops were still visible, but I decided to just let it go and never return. And I was disappointed.

 

[TB'sWidow]

I am a Disney diehard an probably always will be as I like a mixture of thrill an slower paced rides as well as the shows etc. now I have come to appreciate Universal for the experiences they can give as far as WWHP / diagonal alley both areas are great with rides an experiences for a Harry Potter fan as my Dd is but the reliance on those simulation rides is a huge let down in the other areas of the park. We were just there an Fast an Furious was a lame ride so much could have been down with that. I’m looking forward to what they may do with the new park

 

[Jrb1979]

I am a Disney diehard an probably always will be as I like a mixture of thrill an slower paced rides as well as the shows etc. now I have come to appreciate Universal for the experiences they can give as far as WWHP / diagonal alley both areas are great with rides an experiences for a Harry Potter fan as my Dd is but the reliance on those simulation rides is a huge let down in the other areas of the park. We were just there an Fast an Furious was a lame ride so much could have been down with that. I’m looking forward to what they may do with the new park

I am the exact opposite. I love my high thrilling rides. I liked Disney when was there in February but enjoyed Universal more. My favorite park is Cedar Point, being able to 120 mph in 4 secs and up 420 feet is awesome.

 

[DisLiss]

I'm glad Universal is adding a new park. Everything new they do serves to make WDW start considering what they ought to do next, and so on and so forth, and that helps all of us.

Right now Universal's rides don't work well for us as a family. They have thrill rides that only two of us like and screen rides that my DH can't stand at all...he gets so sick. So, by default WDW offers many more rides we can all experience together. We do love the HP sections because there is a lot to just see there. So if the new park is all similar in look and feel to the WWoH areas, then that will be a big help for us.

 

[jscunningham699]

I think the name of the park is stupid! But other than that, I think Universal will give Disney a run for their money like a lot of people have said. Disney needs a 5th gate with nothing but thrill rides and immersive experiences, more than the MK, Epcot, HS and AK put together. Teens and others want thrills...nostalgia is great. I haven't been to Universal in a LONG time, but I love Disney. We have a tripped planned for the first time beginning of September to Disney, our first as a family. I hope my kids love it just as much as I always have.

It only makes sense to build a new park to keep up with the times and compete on a better stage with Universal who is aggressively coming after the business.

 

[Toolulu22]

I agree that Disney has the nostalgia, but that will only last so long. Ex: My husband's favorite ride is Peter Pan and probably 90% of that love is based on nostalgia. When my kids are grown, maybe they will want to ride Peter Pan and laugh about how much their dad loved that stupid ride, but mostly they want something new and more modern. Disney has not kept up with updating things enough.

What I think is exciting is how they are starting with a clean slate in such a huge area. They are not stuck trying to work around what's already there, they can adjust for what has worked and hasn't worked in huge existing parks, etc. I've never even been to Universal, but now I am excited to see what they are going to do.

I agree that Disney has let many aspects become very dated. Epcot is sadly outdated, and now in a shambles adding a mishmash of new elements that don’t fit the original concept of the park and removing elements with nothing there in the interim. But MK rides are showing their age too. Carousel of Progress jumping forward by 20 year segments and suddenly it leaps to modern times (sort of). Some of the elements on various rides look almost homemade - cardboard and glitter. Which it is what it is- but give it a fresh coat of paint, fresh glitter, a little extra something. I’m thinking of Small World, Winnie the Pooh etc. I noticed this a lot during our recent trip.

 

[Disxuni]

When we got to first aid, there were several people already there. No medical people were in sight. I asked the people waiting how long they had been waiting, several had been there for a while. So we just left. I am a registered nurse so I knew I could take care of it, I just didn't have anything to take care of it with.

That sounds so bizarre to me and I'm sorry you've had to experience that. I wonder if that is a regular occurrence at First Aid. I wasn't even at Fist Aid, I was at the front of the entrance on the side where the gift shops and rentals are. I would imagine MK is a busy place for First Aid, but that isn't an excuse. I know at most job places you need at least one person in position, so that sounds strange that no one was there.

I agree that Disney has let many aspects become very dated. Epcot is sadly outdated, and now in a shambles adding a mishmash of new elements that don’t fit the original concept of the park and removing elements with nothing there in the interim. But MK rides are showing their age too. Carousel of Progress jumping forward by 20 year segments and suddenly it leaps to modern times (sort of).

As a huge fan of Disney history I am sad that I never got to experience some of the legendary original attractions and it's tragic to see what once was a park about "tomorrow" and technology, is now nothing of what it once was, and while is getting a complete make-over is nice, I'm afraid it's not going to be in the theme of "tomorrow".

Also, I'll forever proclaim that Carousel of Progress deserves better than what it currently has. It was once an attraction that was updated at least once a decade and a couple of times, the moments in which they chose to update were even closer than a decade apart back in the day. However, it's been almost 30 years since it's last update and I find that pathetic. Whenever I bring this up, a lot of people seem to agree, but a lot also disagree, due to the fact that the technology is more, or less of "today" time frame, so it is not really dated. However, the whole point of this vision in the end is that it is to be the future, not the present and even if it was the present, they could change minor things such as references to a "car phone", or those shoes that Daughter is holding.

 

[skylock]

That sounds so bizarre to me and I'm sorry you've had to experience that. I wonder if that is a regular occurrence at First Aid. I wasn't even at Fist Aid, I was at the front of the entrance on the side where the gift shops and rentals are. I would imagine MK is a busy place for First Aid, but that isn't an excuse. I know at most job places you need at least one person in position, so that sounds strange that no one was there.



As a huge fan of Disney history I am sad that I never got to experience some of the legendary original attractions and it's tragic to see what once was a park about "tomorrow" and technology, is now nothing of what it once was, and while is getting a complete make-over is nice, I'm afraid it's not going to be in the theme of "tomorrow".

Also, I'll forever proclaim that Carousel of Progress deserves better than what it currently has. It was once an attraction that was updated at least once a decade and a couple of times, the moments in which they chose to update were even closer than a decade apart back in the day. However, it's been almost 30 years since it's last update and I find that pathetic. Whenever I bring this up, a lot of people seem to agree, but a lot also disagree, due to the fact that the technology is more, or less of "today" time frame, so it is not really dated. However, the whole point of this vision in the end is that it is to be the future, not the present and even if it was the present, they could change minor things such as references to a "car phone", or those shoes that Daughter is holding.

I actually think disney is lazy. I do like carousel of Progress but it could be updated to at least current times.

 

[Chickinvic]

WDW is a planning nightmare, so I’ve given up on Disney in FL. It wasn’t this way when I was a kid. It wasn’t this way in my 20s. I just don’t see the point. And the resort prices are ridiculous.

So if I want to go on Disney rides, I’ll go to CA. I will only go to Universal in FL. I haven’t been back to Sea World since Blackfish, and I haven’t been back to Disney in five years.

And I just spent an extended weekend at Universal last minute. It was great. No crazy planning. I just showed up and rode rides.

I so much agree with this on the planning thing. I'm there for a vacation - I don't want to have to earn a degree in planning ahead for every little detail. I also find Disney World too unfair to any guest that doesn't stay on property (which I don't). All the good fastpasses are long gone before my booking window opens up. I couldn't be bothered even trying for them anymore. Disneyland California is so much better and their system is more fair. I don't care that resort guests get extra hours - but that should be all they get. They don't need ALL the perks. The rest of us are still paying customers.

 

[Beer Me]

It’s a shot across the bow. Not even close to a body blow. Maybe a slap.

I’ve been going to Disney pretty much my whole life. As an adult we now plan family vacations of at least a week every 2-3 years.

If not for HP I probably would have never gone to Universal at all. But HP happened just when my kids were the right age. We’ve been 4 times since 2010 but never for more than 3 days. I could see stretching it at another day or two but it’s nowhere near as expansive as Disney. The new park will obviously change this and bring Universal a bit closer.

Still I don’t consider Disney vs Universal an apples to apples comparison. I get that a lot of people prefer one or the other but they are not even close in terms of popularity and people spending money, staying onsite etc. And in my opinion Disney parks win on theming, immersion and level of detail. If the new universal park comes close to the quality of the HP lands it will be amazing and could begin to change this perception.

Ultimately the competition keeps everyone in their toes and ultimately benefits all of us who enjoy these parks and resorts.

 

[RamblingMad]

I actually think disney is lazy. I do like carousel of Progress but it could be updated to at least current times.

I agree. Disney has a FL problem.

EPCOT is dated. AK has animals in captivity, which in the long run will be an issue. HS is trying to reinvent itself. If you want nostalgia, WDW will provide since it’s still using dated ride tech.

As for the resorts, you’ll get a bigger bang for your buck at Universal with much better beds.

For shopping, Disney Springs is far better than Citywalk.

And you don’t have to plan a year out.

I so much agree with this on the planning thing. I'm there for a vacation - I don't want to have to earn a degree in planning ahead for every little detail. I also find Disney World too unfair to any guest that doesn't stay on property (which I don't). All the good fastpasses are long gone before my booking window opens up. I couldn't be bothered even trying for them anymore. Disneyland California is so much better and their system is more fair. I don't care that resort guests get extra hours - but that should be all they get. They don't need ALL the perks. The rest of us are still paying customers.

I save so much money going to DL versus WDW. This is money I spend on other vacations such as my annual visit to a National Park. I’d rather go to DL, a National Park, and an international trip than book a week at the Poly and fight for FPs. In what world is that fun?